before we go, a few things to tell you about. tomorrow, we continue a conversation we had earlier, discussing the new arizona fake collectors indictment. i will talk to the arizona secretary of state at 10:00 eastern right here on msnbc. sunday, see the new future documentary, "commitment to life. " he looks back at the fight against hiv a.i.d.s. in los angeles and a community that changed the course of the epidemic 9:00 eastern right here on msnbc and on peacock. some of that is "the last word". "the 11th hour" starts right now. tonight, new witnesses and donald trump's new york trial. trump's longtime personal assistant and michael collins banker take the stand as the

first week of testimony comes to an end. protests over the war in gaza are spreading across america's college campuses. with the growing unrest could mean for president biden's re- election campaign. from books online to e- commerce giants, how amazon became the retailer with everything, everywhere, all at once. "the 11th hour" gets underway on this friday night. good evening, i'm jonathan capehart. we are now 193 days away from the election and today, attorneys for presidential candidate, donald trump, tried to poke holes in a tabloid publisher's sworn testimony after four days stand, david pecker wrapped up testimony in the trump's new york criminal trial , that he helped the trump campaign by covering up true but damaging stories about him.

we then heard from tumor witnesses, a banker and trump's longtime executive assistant. here is laura jarrett with moore. check by the prosecution closed out the first week of testimony by offering the jury a peek inside the inner workings of the trump organization, from one of the people who knows the former president best. the state briefly called rona graff, trump's longtime executive assistant to the stand this afternoon. she confirmed contacts were saved on the company's computer system for karen mcdougal and stormy daniels, and prosecutors say both women were shopping stories of affairs with mr. trump ahead of the 2016 election , encounters that he denies. at the heart of the case, $130,000 payment that michael cohen made to daniels so she would not go public, and how prosecutors say that payment was disguised.

she testified that even though she no longer works for the trump organization, the company is paying her legal bills. the jury also heard from a former banker and first republic bank employee who helped to facilitate the payment , but the day began with the defense team seeking to undercut testimony of david pecker, the former publisher of the national enquirer, and a key witness for prosecutors , testifying at length about how he helped to silence people who could have hurt mr. trump's election chances. trump's lawyers sought to raise questions about david memory and motive. david pecker was defined at one point, saying "i've been truthful to the best of my recollection ." the tabloid mogul also undermined the idea that trump wanted to bury those stories about women to protect his family, a common refrain from the defense. instead, he said he believed it was all to protect his campaign. >> i do have to begin by wishing melania trump happy birthday.

>> reporter: melania trump was notably absent at trial. >> court will not based on session monday so the trial resumes tuesday at 9:30. with that, let's bring in our leadoff panel, john allen, politics reporter for nbc. eugene scott, senior politics reporter fracks yes, and the former federal prosecutor and senior writer for political magazine. thank you for joining us. trump's former longtime executive assistant testified for half an hour. she was known as "the gatekeeper" and set a company directory and numbers for stormy daniels and karen mcdougal. she also said the trump organization was paying her legal bills. why, what did the prosecution gain from her testimony? >> they introduced a small fact, which is that the stormy daniels can't -- contact

information is in the system. i suspect that was presented because we will see the prosecutor's attempt to establish that trump and stormy daniels did, in fact, have an intimate sexual encounter which trump has denied, and trump's lawyers denied in the opening statement. i think this is the first piece of evidence and i guess that there would be more. my guess is prosecutors want to be able to say to jurors at the end of this, you don't have to just take her word, we have additional evidence, trump is been saying she's lying, and this and that. that, to me, is the significance, because if the prosecutors can establish that trump, to the extent that they can establish that trump is lying about anything, it's helpful to their case. it's a big point. he's denied he's had this encounter but appears that it did in fact happen. >> michael collins banker was briefly on stand today and it seems the prosecution is starting to dig into the records . we are talking dollars and

sense, who signed what, specific dates on specific documents. how crucial is it that the prosecution nails this part so they don't have to worry about whether the jury buys the testimony of say, michael collins? >> it's absolutely crucial. these are very high-stakes. the witnesses that we are hearing from now are people who have, i think, a greater record of credibility than michael cullen, who will be the star witness and the one that is easiest for the defense to undermine because he has pleaded guilty in the past to lying. when you see this come up, whether it's "the gatekeeper" or "the banker," there testifying to what to be small, pedestrian things, like our banking transaction works or whose phone number is in the system. that is all the prosecution like a predicate for their story, laying out the details

for the jury of each little piece and trying to build credibility before they ultimately get to michael cullen. they will rely on him as a witness, but they are also going to help and try to make an attempt to have all of these other pieces stack up at side of what cullen says and point to what cullen says so that what he says is greater credibility. >> let's talk about the order of all of this. the prosecution starts with a blockbuster witness, david pecker and are moving into the nitty-gritty. what strategy goes into this sequence? is the mac i think it's largely chronological, so far, as i can see it. they are just trying to tell a story in a simple, chronological fashion, the best way to tell story is often chronological, but i think that's is happening and i expect at some point, perhaps next week, they will start to move into, how are these records, these payments booked internally in the trump

organization that maybe next week, or the following week and the child needs to get there. that's the meat and potatoes of the actual charges against trump. >> eugene, trump keeps complaining about the trial keeping him off the campaign trail, and wednesday, when it was his one day off from court this week, he went golfing. obviously, he does not want to be in court, but is it fair to say he does not seem to care that much about campaigning, either? >> it difficult to make the argument he is prioritizing getting his message to voters who are not already on board with him. he would use this time, if he was, to try to win over independent voters, swing voters, undecided voters which, frankly, is will a larger percentage of the electorate than some people would communicate. instead he's prioritizing is a pastime which should not be a huge surprise to anyone who's

been paying attention to his presidency. he often went golfing during moments when people thought he could do a better job of connect thing with americans who were not sure they had as much confidence in his ability to lead the country. >> john, on the other hand, you've got president biden. he's been very busy on the campaign trail, and he is starting to talk about trump's trial , at least a bit. at one event, he said he has not had a chance to watch the proceedings because he's been campaigning. in the past, he has avoided talking about trump's legal trouble. what does it say, that that is starting to change? >> it says that people around to see donald trump's charges that he faces in four cases, as his greatest liability and the biden campaign and biden himself are talking about that, they are missing an opportunity

to do political damage to donald trump, who, by the way, is making the allegation, not supported by facts or any evidence, that biden is actually using the legal system against him, weapon rising it against him for political gain. biden is taking that, but had not been getting trump on these charges that he faces. we saw it in the earlier case where biden played around and said, you know, donald trump might be alone, might be having financial problems, but i think what is going on is biden trying to go as far as he can to hit trump on his biggest vulnerability without going so far as to support the argument that trump is making, that biden is intentionally weapon rising the justice system against him. >> yeah, eugene, the president sat for an incredibly revealing interview with howard stern this morning. for the first time, he said he would be happy, "happy to

debate donald trump." his campaign refused to commit to a debate for a while. so, why say it now? >> i think he was getting quite a bit of criticism from those on the right, that he was not able to talk about the policy issues that matter most to many voters, specifically those outside his base, and that gave trump a leg up and trump was using that on the campaign trail, suggesting the president was fearful of him, but i think his we get closer to the election, would biden and his team realizes that he has to adopt new strategies to communicate to voters why he is superior to the former president and one way you can do that is being on stage and going towards these policy issues. we might see this happen sooner rather than later, where they are in terms of bringing it to fruition, it's not clear, but there's a shift as we do know

this is not something that the president seems interested in taking forward. >> anybody who thinks that joe biden does not want to debate donald trump does not know joe biden, i'm just going to put that out there. during that interview, the president spoke openly about how much he struggles with a tragic car crash that killed his first wife and one-year-old daughter in 1972. listen to this. >> i used to sit there and think to myself, i'm just going to take a bottle of scotch. we always had liquor in the house, i mean my house, as well. i was just going to drink it and get drunk and i could never bring myself to do it. i actually thought about, you don't have to be crazy to commit suicide. if you been to the top of the mountain and for a brief moment

i thought, maybe i would just go to the bridge and jump. >> truly incredible. the president went on to say that he strongly urges anyone struggling with mental health to seek help and go to therapy. but, how remarkable is it to hear a president openly talk about contemplating suicide and what does it tell us about biden, a human being? >> it's remarkable, that's the right word, and it might be an understatement. president of the united states, candidates in the past, have never wanted to suggest that they have struggled with any mental health issue or in the case is talking about, he doesn't even think it's a mental health issue, given where he had been and what had happened in his life to be in that place of contemplation, but this is not the kind of thing most candidates would talk about it i also believe it is something that is a unique biden strength and has been a strength for him for a long

time, to be able to talk about loss, to be able to talk about pain and tragedy in a way that connects with his fellow americans and connects with voters who have had loss in their lives orix variance pain in their lives, and have that empathy and be able to emote and be so authentic in that moment with howard stern, that the great strengths of joe biden's. it's probably not enough on its own to win the re-election, but it is, when voters look at the candidates and stack them up, the empathy they have for him and his ability to have empathy for them is one of those character traits that i think stands out. >> it's an hour and 15 minutes long, that interview. it is spectacular in just how raw and human the president is, and funny, as someone who has interviewed the president twice during his presidency, i have to say, that was the best interview i've heard with

president biden. i want to get back to the new york trial. we are a week into the testimony. how is the prosecution doing and what are you watching for in the coming days? >> the prosecution is doing fine, so far. again, they are early stages, laying out the the national enquirer, stormy daniels , the banker is on the stand talking about the mechanics of the payments, this and that. there's the common metaphor prosecutors use, is building a case brick by brick, they want a wall of evidence at the end. they are dropping bricks and pieces of evidence and isolation may not seem so fascinating but they are building a wall. whether it leads to conviction remains to be seen, but it's hard to render any serious verdict on this, because they have not gotten to the main event which is, not just michael cohen, whenever he testifies, but there needs to

be some evidence, ideally, that trump himself was aware of the way the payments were booked potentially being unlawful. it's not enough. the hush money payment is not illegal by itself, nor are the machinations michael cohen went through to pay her, but what is allegedly illegal is how those payments were booked. we have not gotten to that, yet. that is what i am waiting for. if the evidence on that score, about trump's knowledge of the legal implications will come exclusively for michael cohen, that would be a major achilles' heel for the case. >> all, thank you for joining us. stomach when we come back, campus unrest is ramping up around the country and we will get into the politics of it during an election year. amazon has worked its way into all of our daily lives from the packages at your doorstep to your doctors office. we take a closer look at its road to domination and how it

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protests, over the war in gaza are spreading across college campuses nationwide. according to npr, more than 500 demonstrators have been arrest did so far. at emory university in georgia, videos show law enforcement using teargas, handcuffs, and tasers to detain everyone, from

students to professors. it's a demonstration of how passionate the students are about the fate of palestinians suffering in gaza, but does it reflect how young voters feel, as we get closer to the election? let me welcome the director of polling at the harvard kennedy school institute of politics, and an msnbc political contributor, and the former florida republican congresswoman, david jolly. thank you for joining us. david, your reaction to the scenes unfolding across campuses? >> look, in october, thomas attacked israel, killing over 1200 people, taking several hundred hostages, including american citizens and i don't think there's anything joe biden can do that would change how benjamin netanyahu executes the war. that's the reality of our politics. what is also true is that domestically, we have a shift among our current alliances

with israel, particularly in the democratic party, and that's okay. the questioning of our current posture. a lot of grace has to be given for the exercise of independent thought on college campuses and for free speech. we also have to recognize that students, particularly jewish students, have to be protected in this moment. it's okay to recognize that israel will continue to execute this war while also recognizing the concerns and speech of young voters in the united states. those two things can coexist. nothing is easy in this moment. what i do think this is, that is untoward and awful, is the manipulation of politicians, 18, 19, ,20 on college campuses, republican or democratic, stay out of this free-speech debate. >> house speaker mike johnson visited columbia university amid protest and his trip was

met with hostility from folks on and off campus. given what you've said, does this add fuel to the fire? >> it does. it's cheap politics, absolutely. these are kids. you get some gray hair, you can recognize grades given to students. i exercise free speech is a student of political areas and places i may or may not regret and it's okay. some of the most passionate movements and domestic politics have been led by students and we should recognize and embrace that. let college communities be college communities. the national politicians, it's cheap shots, stay out of it. we know where geopolitics stand between the united states, israel, and the middle east and we know we want to raise up college kids who are willing and able to exercise their very strong voices, that's okay. you don't have to be threatened . let college kids the college kids and let these campuses work it out. >> well, don't apologize, i

agree. there are two votes for that, i concur. this remains a difficult issue for the biden campaign. according to your latest poll, biden leads trump 45% to 37% among young voters but at this point in the 2020 election, biden led by 23%. is this driving that drop in support? >> i'm not sure you can explain the drop in support directly to this issue. what is clear, to echo what david said, that strong majorities of young people on and off college campuses across the country have sympathy for both the palestinian people and the israeli people. that sympathy does not necessarily connect to the government. young people are calling for peace by a 5 to 1 margin and asking for a permanent cease- fire. the degree to which president

biden, as he did last week, recognizes the innocent civilians, the kidnapped victims in israel, that will connect with younger people. you are right. this race, to me, looks more like the 2012 race where president obama had a 13 or 14 point lead among registered voters to meet romney. we know that doubled between spring and fall. we will see if it happens again. >> i want to pick up on something you just talked about. according to your latest poll, 51% of young voters support a permanent cease-fire but only 2% of respondents cited the israel palestine conflict as their top concern. what is the top priority? >> right. that's an open-ended question. only 2%, overwhelmingly,

younger people, focus groups, the number one concern is the cost of living. it's the rate of inflation that is adding a tremendous amount of stress on a daily basis. a poll that i released today, indicated 42% of young voters feel that stress every day because of the cost of groceries, gas, the cost to access healthcare, and housing. it's the economy that is driving most of the political dialogue among younger people today. this is incredibly important but pales in comparison to inflation today. >> let me read a quote from charles blow, in the new york times. "this seems to be a sense in the biden campaign that it can simply wait the protesters out, that passions will eventually fade or democratic voters will fall in line when we get closer to election day and the choice

between biden and donald trump becomes more stark. that is a reckless gamble." it's interesting to read that, how this reminds john of 2012 and now folks did come back home. do you agree with john or with charles? >> look, it's early, right? it's easy to imagine a world in which by the time we get to democratic national convention, that protest has taken over the dramatics of the convention and concerns over joe biden's foreign policy. what we do know, regardless of demographics, is whether or not the economy is moving in the right directions aims to be the most prevalent question, young, old, latino, african-american, or a white rural voter, it's about the direction and you have to look at moments like you just showed about joe biden's interview with howard stern.

that contemplation with suicide, in a moment of deep darkness for his own personal life, whether or not he drove to the delaware memorial bridge and took his own life? that authenticity, speaking to any family member, white, old, black, brown, whatever it might be, compared to donald trump who exercises grievance politics outside of the courtroom in new york? young voters will realize the contrast and say joe biden is the president i want, come november. >> the only thing i will say to end this segment is that you need to get a pair of thick framed glasses if you are going to be with this trio the next time we are on. david, john, thank you for joining us . when we come back, campus protest to trump's days in court. john b jim puts this historic week into perspective, when "the 11th hour" continues.

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do you think that this moment is as apical as we believe it is, now? >> i think, certainly it is. we have not had to confront it before. in some ways, i think we have taken for granted the freedom that we have enjoyed. i think that the message,

again, it's up to us, but we have to make sure the lesson of this moment, when historians look back, will be that we all met at the moment. >> this is a consequential moment in history. look at what happened this week. witness testimony in the first criminal trial of a former president began in new york. the supreme court is considering the scope of presidential immunity with regard to the former presidents attempted to overturn the 2020 election. college campuses erupted in protest over the israel-hamas war. to help contextualize this moment, i welcome historian, john b jim who occasionally advises president biden. great to see you. a former presidents alleged crimes have been on display in court and that will continue in the coming weeks. we use the term, "unprecedented" a lot, but as a historian, is it?

>> is against my business model to agree with you, but i do. it is unprecedented. for a long time, i thought that what president trump represented and the forces he embodied were a difference of degree, but not of kind, that we dealt with this in the past. this is a difference of kind, however. the assertion of a president, being totally above the law as congresswoman cheney said, other methods -- at the national cathedral this week, we do have to meet this moment and it requires people who put constitution above party, in the way she did, in a remarkably courageous stand. as we listen to the supreme court, we listen to the court try to figure out exactly how to define presidential power

and presidential accountability, we see the former president submitting to the rule of law. as you say, there are protests that are so 1968. you have a moment were so much of we care about, what we should care about, is at risk. what it requires is all of us to decide what side we are on. what is thrilling about that is it is up to us and what is terrifying about it is it is up to us. >> right. give us some perspective on this supreme court, now deciding whether or not a former president can be charged, trump, can be charged for his alleged attempted to overturn the 2020 election. >> you know, look, no president tried to do that. this goes to

your unprecedented point and one of the things, and i urge folks to try to listen to the audio of the argument, what is so remarkable about it is a number of the conservative justices did not want to talk about the actual facts of the case, the context of the moment. why are we having this debate? we are not having this debate because an american president did something in the ordinary course of human events, as jefferson put it. we are having this case, these issues, this fundamental crisis of democracy because, for the first time since george washington took the oath in april of 1789, the first time a president tried to stop the peaceful transfer of power and because he failed does not mean it's not an enduring crisis that requires our attention.

it failed because mike pence did the right thing. a number of state officials did the right thing and our institutions are fragile and fallible and they require human agency, but, to allow an attempted coup d'etat to go unaccounted for is, i think, in violation of the spirit of the rule of law, the explicit point of the american resolution, in america, people ask, was the king, we say the king is the law. >> let's turn to the protest. i know they've reached vanderbilt university in nashville, tennessee. does it bring to mind for you the antiwar protest of the '60s? >> it does.

it is, as you say, it's an unusual level of public demonstration. around the country. i suppose, perhaps, the anti- apartheid protest, of the '80s might be on this scale, but i think that you are seeing a number of complicated and important debates over not just the substance of these issues, but the style, if you will. the means by which these protest are being undertaken. i think that part of it, too, is, and this is pure speculation on my part, i wonder if part of it is that the middle east question has, in some ways, given an entire generation that has lived in an era in which public action has not to deliver, that is, if you

think about this generation, the students i teach, this will make both of us feel old, they were born after september 11th, right? their lives, the failure of intelligence on weapons of mass destruction, the great recession, donald trump's rise, covid, insurrection, you have this remarkably different., it requires people to tell the story of when democracy did in fact deliver. i think that part of this may be a pent up kind of frustration about the failure of the public square to prove itself commensurate to the tasks that they believe are important. >> in the 22nd we have left,

how concerned are you that the democratic convention in chicago in 2024 is going to be reminiscent of the democratic convention in chicago in 1968? >> very. 1968 is one of those years where everything almost fell apart. dr. king was assassinated, senator kennedy was assassinated, 49 americans on average died every day in vietnam, 49. he led the conventions and on election day, richard nixon it defeats hubert humphrey but wallace got 13.5% of the vote, and so it's a similarly chaotic time and i think that the convention has certainly the possibility of being chaotic. >> thank you did when we come back, the inside story of how amazon grew into one of the most

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love it or hate it, amazon has become unavoidable in most of our lives, but how did they go from an online book seller to an e-commerce giant? we sat down with the wall street journal to find out. she's the author of a new book,

"the everything war," which is out now. watch. >> i'm so glad you are here because amazon, the boxes, the act, it's everywhere. ruthless or not, it's almost like an unavoidable utility and so many people's lives. >> jeff bezos set out to make this company a daily habit and he has more than succeeded in this way. if you are taking an uber, that powered by amazon even if you aren't shopping with them. while i was reporting this, amazon bought my doctor's office. they are in every aspect of the economy and urban life and outside of retail, they are one of the biggest parcel deliverers, the biggest cloud computing platform, they are

everywhere. >> the ftc is focused on monopolies, not just amazon, but they are going after them over the next few years and it does not seem like the company cares. the new ceo, his focus is to grow and grow and grow. >> they are wildly unphased which could be a breakup of the company if the ftc wins. he's told his deputies that this could be $1 trillion company. it's $2 trillion, he is saying it's not big enough. the general counsel tells employees that heaters are going to hate, we are shaking this off. >> they are. whether we like it or not, they are. are we going to wake up one day and say, how did this happen? the model has been, sell everything and anything and make it super cheap and for sellers, brick-and-mortar operators, they said you can

sell on our platforms, and they did that. now, everything is getting more expensive for consumers, but for sellers. >> it is a faustian bargain. they have to be there. they talk about oppressive environments, fees are going up, margins are being compressed and they say why are you still there? they say we have to. because amazon has the power, the dynamic is amazon holds the cards, they could raise the fees and pass them on to us. they have to raise their prices and that is what the ftc is alleging, we are paying higher prices because amazon holds the cards. >> is this jeff bezos's plan? this was the plan and now we are living in it and it's potentially too late to unwind? a mac people have been raising alarms about it for a long time if you look at amazon's competitor base. they are one of the few companies that the market leader

on every segment and i've spoken to ceos that have lobbied washington the missing this company has too many advantages. he didn't pay sales tax, then they are doing things we can't compete with and it has come to roost. >> we can say right now that in theory, we don't like it, but i bet there will be amazon boxes outside your house tomorrow and he will be outside mine. we talk about how it's wiping out small businesses did when you go to small towns, they don't have a pizzeria and dress shop because they can't find the labor force because people want to work at amazon because the pay is better and the benefit are better. as much as we can plane -- complain, is this the world we are living in and most likely, it's not going anywhere? >> americans have a reliance on this company in a way that is hurt there main streets, the smaller businesses trying to compete, and that's the funny part of it. when i speak to consumers, they understand where amazon might

be pushing the boundaries on competitive tactics, but they love amazon prime so it's a catch 22. >> what was your biggest surprise? here is this behemoth in our daily lives and there might be things we don't know that we should. >> i discovered a pattern of predatory behavior in the company driven by a cutthroat culture. people do what they can to stay ahead and keep their jobs and there is this pattern of copying entrepreneurs they meet with, their sellers, to reverse engineer their best-selling products so amazon has their own home runs and that has hurt innovation, these businesses, and means amazon is able to mine it really dependent base of partners and sellers for ideas. >> they won the game. >> some might say they already won. >> so this book, your new book, is it being sold on amazon?

>> it is, as of right now. >> it sounds like they've already won. congratulations on the book, it's a must read. it's a really important thing. thank you. >> amazon responded to allegations in a statement, "the factual amazon has made shopping easier and more convenient for customers, spurred lower prices, enabled millions of successful small businesses, and significantly increase competition in retail." when we come back, sipping on success. how one town in wisconsin was saved by beer, when "the 11th hour" continues.

the last thing before we go, business composition once in a small rural town, once in decline, but now residents are tapping into history to get their hometown back on the map. my colleague brings us this story. >> reporter: in the hub of this factory in rural wisconsin and, lies the sound of a small towns second wind. this story, best told over a pint, begins in 1852 with the birth of the pitocin brewing company. a major employer until the 1970s when composition turned

off it taps. >> almost everyone in potosi had a relative who were to there. >> it was in existence for 120 years. >> the brewery crumbled. it went up for auction. gary david bought it for $6300. >> i have a very fond memories he -- memory of the forefathers that came before us. >> dave fritz launched the potosi foundation to bring the brewery back. >> it was all about jobs, to me. >> a way to keep a small town alive. >> reporter: for years, the fund raised , 2008, rebuilding the taproom and then a new factory. >> people are packaging more than 80 million cans per year of potosi beer and other beverage companies from across the country. >> buzz followed, now home to the national brewery museum and annual festivals.

>> reporter: potosi get 70,000 tauris a year. that's a lot of people. >> how good does that beer taste ? >> really great. >> reporter: the taste of the towns come back. nbc news, potosi, wisconsin. >> choose to potosi. i wish you a good night. you can catch me every weekend, saturday and sunday show, right here on msnbc. next, we have a look back at donald trump's criminal trial, today. from all of our colleagues across the networks of nbc news, thank you for joining us. see you this weekend. he would tell stories about how he had angels protecting him, and people who had crossed him in the past he would tell stories d dia how he had angels protecting him, and people who had crossed him in the