this was really a good experience for me. i took a lot of notes about what was going on. it was very interesting for me. >> i love seeing david testimony. he was definitely more inclined to help the former president. >> what was your impression of the president? >> he seemed much more contained than he normally is. and definitely i could see him, he was nodding off at times. >> yeah. >> at the beginning when everyone was first setting up, he was squirming a lot. then he seemed unnaturally still. >> good insight from future

lawyers hope and owen to take us off the air this evening. and on that very important note, i wish you a very good night. from all of our colleagues across the networks of nbc news, thanks for staying up late with me. i'll see you at the end of tomorrow. tomorrow. they did it out in the open. they tweeted this video. then they applauded themselves when they were done. 11 arizona republicans met on december 14, 2020 at republican party headquarters in phoenix and signed documents representing themselves as the duly elected and qualified electors for president and vice president of the united states of america from the state of arizona. and they transmitted them to

the national archives and congress. for counts by mike pence january 6th. though joe biden had won arizona by more than 10,000 votes. and you know the rest. the attorney general has indicted them on felony criminal charges along with seven other coconspire soars affiliated with trump's 2020 presidential campaign. those coconspirators are names that will be familiar to you. according to reporting from multiple outlets they are mark meadows, trump's former white house chief of staff. rudy giuliani, general in ellis, john eastman and christina bobb all representing donald trump in various post election lawsuits. along with trump campaign officials boris epstein and mike ronan. five of them were indicted for similar conduct in the state of

georgia where jenna ellis has already pleaded guilty. they were part of a multistate scheme to help trump overturn the results of the 2020 election. and there are already prosecutions of some of these involved in that multistate scheme including georgia, michigan, and nevada. but tonight marks the first time that criminal charges are being brought in the state of arizona. >> we are here because justice demands an answer to the efforts of the defendants and other unindicted coconspirators allegedly took to undermine the will of arizona's voters during the 2020 presidential election. arizona's election was free and fair. the people of arizona elected president biden. unwilling to accept this fact, the defendants charged by the state grand jury allegedly

schemed to prevent the lawful transfer of the presidency. a grand jury has handed down 11 felony indictments. these charges include fraud, forgery, and conspiracy. they are class 2, 4, and 5 felonies. these are serious indictments. >> as for donald trump himself, he is not charged in this indictment. but he does appear as unindicted coconspirator number one. joining me now are nbc news correspondent vaughn hillyard and lisa ruben. first, my first thought when i read this was okay. who will plead out? because we saw a similar scenario plus trump in georgia and we have seen plea deals there. and i wonder, this is a fairly

wide net. is your expectation some of them will plead out? >> some of the usual suspects are already unindicted coconspirators because they chose in advance of the indictment to cooperate. namely, ken chezboro appear to be unindicted coconspirator four. on the other hand, you have all 11 alternate or fake electors. chances are more than one of them will eventually plead out and give their cooperation. >> it is notable that kenneth seems to be and this is according to some reporting in the washington post, he appears to be an important source. kris mayes had been squarely

focused on local conservatives up until late last year. he provided records that revealed more information about the arizona effort. after that, they said, the arizona investigation widened. how did she go about this? because it sounds like she started near the top. >> the arizona targets are the easiest of targets. as you said, they did it out in the open. they were openly tweeting about it posting the video of what they did. the other seven individuals, the like of john eastman, rudy giuliani. christina bobb are redacted because they have yet to be served. these are individuals that were

tougher targets here and part of a greater conspiracy. she could have focused on the 11 electors but kris mayes clearly intended to target and make it clear that this conspiracy was not only a threat to the 2020 election, but also the 2022 election and potentially future elections and clearly made the decision to proceed. and if i may, what is notable about her indictment here is the fact that she specifically out lines the fact that she contends that the 11 electors as well as the other seven who are indicted as well, that were trump attorneys or trump campaign officials they intended to deceive the arizona voters. i just want to read part of this. defendants deceive the citizens of arizona falsely claiming

those votes were contingent on a legal challenge that would change the outcome of the election. in reality, defendants intended that their false votes would encourage pence to reject the biden era's votes on january 6, 2021 regardless of the outcome of the legal challenge. i was there on the ground in arizona as all of this was unfolding and i can tell you i remember so distinctly that they were just making the case that well this is just an if in the scenario we found fraud. that mike pence could go this route. but what chris is outlining in this indictment is this was a conspiracy intended for on january 6th or in the two weeks to follow, to seat donald trump as president. whether he actually had 270 electoral college votes or not. >> i was struck by the same passage. can we bring it back up again? this seems legally very, very significant. that this sort of cover under which some of these fake electors have operated. this was a contingency plan.

she completely disassembles that. >> right. i thought that passage about the email sent from unindicted coconspirator five to pennsylvania attorney is really damning because it says just fyi, i recall now there was a rush to file our petition to give legal cover for the electors in arizona to vote on the 14th. that email is stunning. and that has been in the public domain before. you can identify from other public reporting who the unindicted coconspirator is. but i had forgotten about these details. it is like the hush money trial going on we have known for years. so, too, is this an email that has been in the public domain. but juxtaposed against all of the litigation filed in arizona to see it one after the other, fail. and then this submission, oh by

the way, this was the cover. we were supposed to file this other lawsuit in order to give legal cover. >> we are giving you a reason. >> correct. >> and it is all there. >> you know, vaughn, when we talk about the ways in which this is an effort on the part of the ag, not just to seek accountability for what happened in 2020. but ensure against future fraudulent election behavior. you pointed this out that some of these people who have been indicted are still very much involved with the arizona election infrastructure. can you talk a little bit more about that? >> let's use tyler boyar as an example. tyler boyar will not be a household name to most folks but he is the rnc committee man from arizona. he is the one, winter meting, summer meeting. he has the vote for arizona. the chair of the party. he is the person who who is not only one of the fake electors

indicted, but he is also the chief operating officer of turning point usa which is the charlie kirk organization, the trump align organization that garnered millions of dollars and has taken over the arizona republican party in recent years. they are closer to the likes of kari lake. the opponent to chris who was an election denier. there has been a lot of frustration in the republican party from some folks who have been around with individuals like tyler boyar and it is kelly ward as well. who came in and had this revolution. they ousted the likes of john mccain. they ousted jeff flake. kelly ward ran against jeff flake he was losing in polling to kelly wardment all of these years later these folks effectively took over the

party. are still effectively running the party. and there is little evidence of this. it is the same allies these very individuals along with folks like boris epstein who is also indicted in this. who continue to be the lead counsel adviser. legal adviser for donald trump's 2024 campaign. they are all in it. trying to bring justice to past actions. but these are folks that are still intimately involved with what is happening over the next six months. >> what do you see as the handshake between the georgia case and the arizona case given the overlapping defendants in both? the fact that jenna ellis pleaded out in georgia. does that suggest to you she will plead out here?

what can we map from georgia onto arizona? >> it is difficult to say. one thing that strikes me, the former president of the united states who is not a defendant here. that leaves many people scratching their heads as to why not. i will venture one guess. they will hear trump's presidential immunity argument. he has made arguments not only in the federal election interference case, but also in the georgia case. also in the florida case. one reason that kris mayes may not have indicted donald trump is she wants to see how it plays out first and also, give some of those indicted a chance to flip against the boss. >> just when you think the screw has turned. all the ways it can. there is another turn of the

script. vaughn hillyard. amazing reporting. deep arizona knowledge. deep cuts from in the arizona election interference. really appreciate your time tonight. >> thanks alex. >> lisa, stay with me. we got a lot more for you. coming up, trump hads a new nickname tonight. unindicted coconspirator number one. tomorrow he will be back in a manhattan courtroom and known as defendant trump in his criminal hush money trial. we'll have more on the former president's escalating legal dramas coming up next. escalatil dramas coming up next. (♪♪) ohhh crap, that's a really good gift. now we gotta get france something. wait! we can use etsy's new gift mode! yes, what do the french like? ...anyone? cheese... they like cheese! brilliant. done. plateau de fromage! oh la la! [cheering] don't panic. gift easy with gift mode, new on etsy.

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seeking incarceration, jail time for president trump, they believe that trump seems to be angling for just that. and for what it's worth, right wing media seems to be angling for that, too. >> i would force them to throw me in jail if i were donald trump. the mug shot backfired. the indictments have been backfired. being a martyr in jail for maybe what a day? 24 hours? >> if they put him in jail for his fist amendment right, he will be like nelson mandela. >> will he be like nelson mandela? anyway, right after the hearing on trump's gagger order yesterday, right after trump was warned again that if he kept breaking the rules of the gag order he could be thrown in jail, pretty much as soon as the court went to break and he was allowed to use his phone again, donald trump posted this to truth social. highly conflicted to put it

mildly. judge juan merchan has taken away my constitutional right to free speech. everybody is allowed to talk. the judge should recuse himself. while attacking the judge does not run afoul of the gag order, trump is clearly poking the bear running right up to the line of what's allowed. and there is yes, the legal side of this gag order and we will get expert help unpacking that in a minute. there is also the media component. we learned how the national enquirer and donald trump were in cahoots. not just when it came to catching and killing stories about trump but about the explicit agreement between trump and the national enquirer. the national enquirer would publish glowing stories about trump and negative stories about his political opponents. ones that the enquirer would just completely fabricate. so trump and the national

enquirer, they gave the reader whats they wanted. and just to be clear here, it was a totally unethical arrangement but it really seems like trump and the right wing media today are doing something quite similar. there may not be an explicit agreement, but there is a symbiotic relationship here and that could matter when it comes to this gag order. from the very beginning of this trial, right wing media has been repeating trump's lies about this case. even the small stuff claiming the judge barred trump from going to his son's high school graduation. in reality, the judge has yet to make a decision on that request. in ways both big and small, right wing media has been diminishing trump's legal actions in this case claiming trump being prosecuted is the real injustice here. >> do you think that is just

compensation for nondisclosure agreement which happens all the time in big businesses especially? >> it was not wrong. you hire lawyers to solve problems. that's it. >> you back up 2,000 years, and this is the kind of thing they would do in the roman republic that led to the end of the roman republic. >> i big to differ on that last point. trump has himself twice now had his aides print out a big stack of articles for him. articles he then waves around outside the courthouse claiming that the content of these articles vindicates him. >> these are articles that were over the last day-and-a-half, very good articles. they tell you the case is a sham. and shouldn't be tried. it shoulden have been submitted. andrew mccarthy. every one of them saying this is a zombie case. >> the people trump listed off

there, greg jared, andrew mccarthy. the authors of the articles trump says vindicate him, all of these people are fox news the contributors. analysts. very likely paid by fox and all of them are saying things wildly off from what the rest of the legal world has concluded about this case. as much as donald trump is kicking and screaming about how he needs to be able to attack the witnesses and the prosecutors and the jury, so trump can mount a proper defense, does donald trump need to do it himself? because he sure seems to have plenty of other people doing that for him already. last week, right wing media and in particular, fox news host jesse waters demonized individual members of this juror, was trump quoting jesse waters saying they are catching

undercover liberal activists trying to get on the jury. but here's the thing. jesse waters didn't say that. trump added the part that read in order to get on the trump jury. but within hours, jesse waters corrected trump's mistake for him, posting trump's incorrect version of the quote to water's own twitter account in effect retro actively making his own words the words trump wanted them to be. quite clearly and quite literally, they are heeding trump's calls. they are taking his line edits. >> the guy needs exercise. he is usually golfing. and so, you will put a man who is almost 80 sitting like a room on his butt all this time? it is unhealthyment he needs sunlight and activity. they are freezing him to death. putting him in a meat locker. he says it's like 45-degree ins

there and putting his life in danger. >> back with me again is lisa ruben. and bryan stelter. vanity fair special correspondent author of network of lies. the epic saga of fox news. donald trump and the battle for american democracy. thank you for being here, what is the point of a gag order honestly? when you have a media industrial complex acting as a public defense line for donald trump? >> you are asking the right question. this was on my mind last week. no matter how much was shared by the new york times or the ap, there will be fox and the other outlets trying to intimidate the jurors. a week late story is true when it comes to the witnesses. it is so important you are identifying this. we have to see while we are on effort one, what is happening on earth two? tucker carlson was fired by fox

news and they are a little less in crazyville as a result. tucker believes in ufos and connections to god. for jesse waters, trump is god. and that's the programming every hour of every day on the other networks. >> can i ask you because you have been inside the fox complex, you have deep connections and have reported out from there. they say we want a story about ted cruz. go write one. and the national enquirer would do it. do you think that trump even has the ability to have an arrangement like that? he communicates directly with sean hannitd. >> murdoc is not wired in the way his father rupert was or other moguls like david pecker were. he wants to keep the business humming. this is all about business. that is exactly what is the

same with david pecker and the inquirer. this is about a financial relationship. they believe they have a fiduciary, they believe this is the responsibility to the shareholders then you will see on the air on fox, when they interview voters the voters are saying the exact same things. >> it's a feed back loop. this seems like terror incognito. i was there when multiple jurors said i'm worry about my safety and the judge said i'm directing that the press simply apply common sense and refrain from writing about anything that has to do with physical descriptions of the jurors. that is just not necessary. he is asking the press and that included the mainstream. but is his ability to circumscribe the amount of information put out there as it concerns the press, reduced to just requests or is there anything legally he could do to

guard against this? >> i think many of us in the press were in that room, took the requests more as a directive as he continued in that court transcript. it became clear it wasn't really much of a request at all and people were bristling what they perceived was an incursion on their rights. i want to go back to something you were discussing about the feed back loop. i think there is a feedback loop to the gag order. one of the things that struck me is trump took something he liked that jesse waters said at 5:00. heeded to it and made it more insidious. then three hours later the entire thing comes back out of jesse waters' mouth. to extent the gag order succeeds. trump getting amplified by condition conservative media.

that might be a good thing when the da's office is arguing republication is a violation of the gag order in and of itself. it prohibits making statements or directing others to make statements. it doesn't prohibit publication. the da's office almost laughed at that and said your honor, this isn't a totally fair analogy. but, defamation law prohibits republication. if you can be held liable for republishing someone else's lies why is it okay for him to do it in the context of the gag order? >> don't sleep on this. when he is sharing these lies from fox, he is misinforming himself as well as his fans. he is actually getting a warped sense of this trial. of the surroundings. why his fans are not showing up to the courthouse which cracks me up he thinks thousands are being denied entry. he is being misinformed which really hurt his presidency and it is hurting his post presidency as well. all of us in our lives need

someone to tell us the truth. that we have ketchup on our tie or when there is hair dye dripping down our face. he has people who lie to him on television every day and night. i would argue that probably hurts him over time during this trial. >> do you think removing him from part of the feedback loop changes this mendacity, independent of donald trump. remember that donald trump just retweeted and edited version of what jesse waters came up with. does the toxicity level increase? >> i want to point that out as something to you. the dynamic between merchan and trump is a parallel to trump and lou caplin. i'm reading from an nbc news article. at the last trial, he said mr.

trump, i hope i don't have to consider excluding you from the trial. i understand you are very eager for me to do that. i remember him sort of pounding the table saying ill would love that. and that is the dynamic going on with merchan. so the trip for him is to hold out the stick without actually hitting trump with it. >> we started this segment talking about the ways in which trump is running right up to the line. right wing media saying go get arrested. sit in the cell for six hours. it is not only going to be great for your brand, it will be great for fund raising. we have details. trump raised $5.6 million in the first week of the hush money trial. he knows where his bread is buttered on. >> it is so perverse all of a sudden the law and order republicans care deeply about the humanity of the criminal justice system. jesse water is comparing his treatment to guantanamo bay

prisoners. i fantasize we will see movement result two actually improve the prisons and the courthouses. i know it will not happen. but it is incredible to see how they are waking up to what it is like to be a criminal defendant. >> as it concerns one particular person. >> that is what this is about. they are worshiping their cult leader. >> why haven't we gotten a ruling from judge merchan on this? >> he said yesterday at the end of the hearing he wanted the party to give him any additional authority they wanted to bring to his attention. that publication was not a violation of the gag order. he did not. so both parties have an invitation to give him more between tuesday night and today. i suspect we will see something from the judge tomorrow night or friday in writing that he will read from the bench and make available for the public to see. in the meantime, the da's office has told us they will

file a third order to show cause. with respect to some additional statements and just yesterday, while we were at the trial, donald trump i guess before the trial must have done an interview with a news outlet in which he said some of the same things about michael cohen that have gotten him in this pickle in the first place. so, you know, the escalation is happening even before the verdict or the ruling comes out on these existing violations. >> yes, poking the bear literally. hopefully the guardrails will narrow tomorrow. when the trial begins again with david pecker on the stand. lisa and bryan, no two better people to talk about this with. thank you for your time. still ahead tonight, i will talk to congresswoman ilhan omar about the protests in gaza. but first, tomorrow morning at 10:00 a.m. sharp, the supreme court will finally hear arguments on the question donald trump hopes is his get out of jail free card. is he immune from prosecution for everything he did while he was president?

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tomorrow morning at 10:00 a.m., the supreme court will hear oral arguments in donald j. trump versus the united states. that is the case that will decide whether trump can claim presidential immunity for his actions in and around the 2020

election and election subversion. and therefore, have his federal election interference case dismissed. now, this case is effectively frozen since december as the appeals process has dragged onto the chagrin of anyone hoping the high court might expedite its ruling. seven weeks ago, the supreme court decided to add this case to the end of its current term. which could mean that its decision may not come down until as late as july. the mere fact the supreme court chose to take up this case in the first place guaranteed some kind of delay. and that in the end may be the most significant result of this appeal. here is rolling stone describing team trump's attitude. team trump is ready to lose the supreme court immunity case. they are celebrating. donald trump's inner circle doesn't expect the supreme court to go along with his extreme case. but we already pulled off the heist, says a source close to

trump. joining us now is mark joseph stern. senior writer covering the courts and the law for slate magazine. mark, thank you for being here tonight. do you have any sort of game strategy as what the conservative and liberal justices might do in terms of question and answer? >> i don't think the liberal justices are going to go as hard as some of us might like to see at trump's attorneys. i think their number one goal will be to get john roberts, brett kavanaugh and amy coney barrett on board with a decision that is quick and firm and can be sent down to the lower courts to kick this in motion. those three conservatives are the ones to watch. thomas alito has staked out a strong pro trump position. gorsuch in between. but for roberts he probably

recognizes at this point what the rolling stone article pointed out. team trump has pulled off the heist. the supreme court has slow walked this case as compared to the ballots removal case from earlier this term. the nixon cases in the 1970s during water gate. they ensured this trial will not happen before november before election day. and you know, when john roberts is embarrassed by a case, sometimes he goes quiet. he doesn't say anything. so one thing i will be looking to is whether the chief justice mostly keeps his mouth shut or whether he trying to direct arguments toward some kind of consensus position. >> i know the supreme court is quote unquote inpenetrable and don't pay attention to press. and are not victim to whatever the political climate of the day is. a will inform the time line which

they rule. do you think they will expedite their ruling at all? >> u do not and i will tell you why. the rule at the supreme court is as long as a dissenter is writing his or her opinion, the court will not release the ruling. that was put to the test after the draft decision in dobbs leaked. that decision overturning roe v. wade. we know the conservative justices pressed to release that decision quickly while the dissenters were still writing but they decided to not release it until the end of the term. i think that tradition will hold here as well and it effectively gives sam alito and clarence thomas an opportunity to help run out the clock for trump. they might take longer than they really need to in writing their dissents. drag this out until the end of june. perhaps the beginning of july. and in effect, push this trial date back even further. there is really nothing that the other justices can do about that. so i do not think we should expect a quick ruling in this

case. he perhaps has a conflict of interest. would you expect he will be vocal tomorrow? >> absolutely. clarence thomas' superpower is shamelessness. 350 of the january 6th rioters as well as donald trump. he was leading the charge arguing the obstruction charges brought against the rioters was illegitimate. he was accusing the justice department of engaging in selective prosecution whipping out this arcane statute. he was out front and center in really criticizing the justice department's strategy of

prosecuting january 6th insurrectionists. i don't think he has any shame about this. i think if he takes a pro trump stance in this case, he will be very vocal. he will attempt to lead the court in that direction and not feel any sense of reticence just because his wife tried to overturn the election and was are present for trump's speech at the ellipse january 6th. >> just wow. and a real crisis point for the credibility of this court as it decides major cases this term. we will see what tomorrow holds. mark joseph stern, great to talk to you. thanks my friend. >> thank you. coming up, as the right wing tries to oust him, house speaker mike johnson today found time to visit columbia university and demand someone else be fired. this time over pro palestinian protests. coincidence there? congresswoman ilhan omar joins me to discuss after the break. . harlem has everything. but i couldn't find pilates anywhere. so i started my own studio. and with the right help, i can make this place

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protesting peacefully. >> that was the scene in austin earlier today after students at the university of texas walked out of class to peacefully protest the ongoing war in gaza. state and university police some of whom were dressed in riot gear descended onto the crowd resulting in the violent clashes you see here. dozens of student protests have taken place on college campuses across the country. and around the world.

this past week. protests sparked by the ongoing humanitarian crisis in gaza. where death tolls continue to rise and reports of mass graves outside of hospitals. there is an encampment style protest on day eight at columbia university here in new york city. speaker mike johnson and his fellow republicans traveled to columbia's campus to speak out against allegations of anti- semitism and to chastise the protesters. >> my message to the students inside the encampment is get, go back to class and stop the nonsense. stop wasting your parents' money. congressman lawler says. i think that is right. >> i don't know who is in the camp. but i would tell you this is unacceptable and the american people are demanding accountability for it. >> joining me now is democratic congresswoman ilhan omar who loss been outspoken about these protests. we are so happy to have her on

the program. thank you for joining me congresswoman. >> thank you very much. >> as a matter of political strategy, do you see a connection between the fact the far right maga caucus is actively trying to oust speaker johnson and today he went to columbia to prove his far right credentials? >> no. i mean it is very much a coincidence. this is a man who is holding onto his speakership. it is not surprising that he would go out to columbia and stir up more anger and hate and endanger the lives of young people who are at the encampment at columbia university. >> do you have a theory? i have a theory. the way the right wing has taken out of the debate over

free speech slash anti-semitism and just made this a war against quote unquote liberal elites. i have to call out what appears to be, i don't know, staggering hypocrisy on the part of josh hawley calling for the national guard to come in and disperse the protests. the same josh hawley fist pumping in solidarity with january 6th rioters outside the january 6th capitol. how do you explain the discrepancy? >> it is a complete clown show. these people do not care about violent protests. they don't care about first amendment. they care about performing political theater. which they most of the time do. these are people who supported insurrectionists on january 6th who threatened my life and the lives of all of our

colleagues who threatened the peaceful transfer of governance. it is really astonishing they want to be taken seriously today as they call for the national guard to come in. this is also a group of people who are first to criticize other countries as authoritarians when they call in the military to crack down on peaceful protests and people stepping up on their rights. people standing up for human rights. people speaking out against their government utilizing their own resources, their tax dollar to help in what has been considered a genocide israel is carrying out against the people of gaza. i want people to actually understand why these kids are risking their academics and their ability to stay in good

standing. they are worried what it means to grow up in a world watching 35,000 people be killed. to watch nearly 70% of them be children and women to watch the destruction of 80% of infrastructure. to see a country withhold water, food, electricity, to starve people. and carry out you know, collective punishment. israel is being hauled in front of the international courts and being accused of genocide. these kids don't want us to be complacent. they don't want their tax dollar to be complacent. for the member who said don't waste your parents' money, they don't want their parents' money to go in supporting a genocide that they oppose. so i do believe that history is going to be on their side.

these people are standing for immorally just right cause are going to be looked at and mocked in history. >> i know you recently visited an encampment at the university of minnesota. your daughter was expelled from a residence for being involved in the protest in that campus. senator tom said your speech at that encampment solidifies the democrat party as the pro terrorist party. what is your response to an accusation like that? >> i can't consume emmer's failure. he will not use me to get in good standing with his conference. this is probably one of the worst whips to exist in the history of congress. what i did was stand in solidarity with young people who are antiwar and don't want

their resources utilized for war. he stands with insurrectionists and believes that it is okay for his conference to visit january 6th insurrectionist prisoners and call them political disdents. this whole conference is a joke and nobody should take them seriously. >> in the meantime, we are seeing widespread protests, outcry for what is happening over in gaza. congresswoman ilhan omar, thank you for your time and thoughts on this. really appreciate it. >> thank you for having me. >> we'll be right back. >> we'll be right back. wanna know a secret? with new secret outlast, you can almost miss the bus... but smell like you didn't. secret fights 99% of odor-causing bacteria. smell fresh for up to 72 hours. secret works! it's a crime to smell that good.

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a quick programming note for you. in just 12 hours, the supreme court will hear oral arguments on on donald trump's claim he