precisely what is at issue here. my understanding from the arguments today is that the way that idaho state law works and other state laws work now as not preempted is that doctors wait around until there is a certainty of essentially death before they can intervene. >> they admitted today basically that you don't get a light pole. it is not like this is when you connect and this is when you can't. at the end of the day -- >> as a clinical decision, that has to be impossible. >> it is gutwrenching to watch someone bleeding front of you when you know what to do and you can't do it because you are afraid that you will get arrested but be, you will do it and it won't work because it is too late. at the end of the day, it is time to stop interfering, stop letting politicians get in the middle of the emergency department and patient care and just say we want to do our job and save people's lives. >> dr. dara kass, thank you very much, i appreciate it. that is all in on this wednesday night. alex wagner night starts right now. good evening, alex. >> we have a lot of breaking news. thank you, as always. they did it out in the open and they were proud of it. they created this video as they

did it. and then they applauded themselves when they were done. 11 arizona republicans met on december 14th, 2020 at republican party headquarters in phoenix and signed documents for presenting themselves as the duly elected and qualified electors for president and vice president of the united states of america from the state of arizona. then they transmitted this document to the national archives and to congress for counting by vice president mike pence on january 6th. even though joe biden had won arizona by more than 10,000 votes. and, you know the rest. tonight, arizona attorney general, chris mays, has indicted those 11 fake electors on felony criminal charges, along with seven other co- conspirators affiliated with trumps 2020 presidential

campaign. those co-conspirators are names that will be familiar to you. according to reporting from multiple outlets, they are marked manos, trumps former white house chief of staff, rudy giuliani, jenna ellis, john eastman and christina bobb, all of whom were lawyers advising donald trump in various postelection lawsuits and schemes, along with trump campaign officials mike roman and boris epshteyn. five of these people were indicted for similar conduct in the state of georgia, where jenna ellis has pleaded guilty. the 11 fake electors were part of a multistate scheme to help donald trump overturned a result of the 2020 election. there are already prosecutions of at least some of these fake electors in three of the seven states involved in the multistate scheme, including

georgia, michigan, and nevada. but, tonight marks the first time that criminal charges are being brought in the state of arizona. >> we are here because justice demands an answer to the efforts the defendants and other unindicted co-conspirators allegedly took to undermine the will of arizona's voters during the 2020 presidential election. arizona's election was free and fair. the people of arizona elected president biden. unwilling to accept this fact, the defendants charged by the state grand jury allegedly schemed to prevent unlawful transfer of the presidency. a state grand jury made up of everyday regular arizonans have now handed down felony indictments for all 11 republican electors, as well as several others connected to the scheme. these charges include fraud, forgery, and conspiracy. these charges are class two, four, and five felonies. these are serious indictments.

>> as far donald trump himself, he is not charged in this indictment but he does appear as unindicted co-conspirator number one. joining me now are nbc news correspondent von hilliard and lisa rubin, msnbc legal correspondent. my first thought when i read this was, okay, who is going to pay up? we saw a similar scenario minus 20 1+20 and we saw plea deals there and i wonder, this is a fairly, relatively wide net, 18 people in this. is your expectations some of them will plead out and become witnesses for the state ? >> yes, although some of the usual suspects are already unindicted co-conspirators because they chose in advance of the indictment to cooperate, namely, kenneth chesborough.

there is no role for city powell, who is the person to have played out in georgia. on the other end, you have all 11 arizona alternate or fake electors indicted here. chances are that more than one of them will eventually plead out and give their cooperation. >> it is notable that kenneth chesebro seems to be, this is according to some reporting in ""the washington post"," he seems to have been an important source in all of this. i will read an expert from the post reported tonight, "chris mays had been squarely focused on local conservatives up until late last year. arizona prosecutors and investigators met in december with kenneth chesebro. kenneth chesebro provided mays team with records, some previously unseen, that we got more information about those involved in the arizona effort. after that, they said the arizona investigation widened. " how did she do about this? it sounds like she starting at

the top, which is the inverse of how the doj approach the january 6th related controversies. >> the arizona targets were the easiest of targets because, as you said, alex, they did it out in the open. they were tweeting about it, they were posting the video of what they did on december 14th when they signed the certificate, the fake certificate and send it to washington, d.c. these other seven individuals, the likes of john eastman, rudy giuliani, christina bobb, that are still rejected in this indictment because they have yet to be served here, these are individuals that were for targets here in part of a greater conspiracy that is outlined by chris mays. this investigation we reported on this last summer and clearly she had easier targets. she could have focused on the 11 electors. chris mays came into office in january of last year and clearly intended to target and

make it clear that this conspiracy was not only a threat to the 2020 election but also a 2022 election and potentially future elections and clearly made the decision to proceed and cast a wider net. what is notable about her indictments here is that the fact that she specifically outlines the fact that she contends the 11 electors, as well as these other seven who are indicted as well, that were trump attorneys or trump campaign officials, they intended to deceive the arizona voters. i want to read part of this. "defendants deceived the citizens of arizona by falsely claiming those votes were contingent only on a legal challenge that would change the outcome of the election. in reality, defendants intended their false votes for trump and pence would encourage mike pence to reject the biden/harris votes on january 6th, 2021, regardless of the outcome of the legal challenge." i was there on the ground and arizona as this was unfolding, alex. i can tell you i remember sadistically how they were making the case that this is just an if in the scenario we actually found fraud that mike

pence could then go this route. what chris mays is outlining in this indictment and that this was a conspiracy intended for on january 6th were in those two weeks to follow two-seat donald trump as president, whether he actually had 270 electoral college votes or not. >> we actually, i was struck by the same passage in the indictment. can we bring it back up again? lisa, this seems legally significant, the sort of cover under which these fake electors have operated not just in arizona but in other states. this was a contingency plan. she dissemble slot disassembled that in the end. >> i thought that that passage about the email sent from unindicted co-conspirator five two the pennsylvania attorney is really damming because it says just fyi, i recall now was a rush to file our petition in order to give legal cover for the electors in arizona to vote on the 14th. that email is a stunning. that

has been in the public domain before. you can identify from other public recording who the unindicted co-conspirator is. but, i had forgotten about these details. it is just like many of the details in the hush money trial that is currently going on are things that we have known for years. so to is this you know that's been out in the public domain. juxtaposed against all of the litigation that was filed in arizona, to see one after the other after the other file and then this admission from the unindicted co-conspirator, oh, by the way, this was the cover. we were supposed to file this other lawsuit in order to give legal cover to the fake electors scheme. >> we are giving you a reason. >> correct. >> when we talk about the ways in which this is an effort on the part of the aji not just to seek accountability for what happened in 2020 but i think ensure against future fraudulent election behavior, you pointed this out in the

conversation with my colleague chris hayes last hour that some of these people who have been invited are still very much involved with the arizona election infra structure. can you talk a little more about that? >> let's use tyler bowyer as an example. tyler bowyer will not be a helpful thing to most folks but he is the rnc committeeman from arizona. he is the one that at every rnc meeting, winter meeting, summer meeting of the has the vote for arizona. the chair of the party, for example. he is the person who is not only one of these fake electors indicted but also rnc amity man but he's also the chief operating officer of turning point usa, which is the charlie cook organization, the trump aligned organization that has garnered millions of dollars and has effectively taken over the arizona republican party in recent years. tyler bowyer, charlie cook, they are close with the likes of kari lake, and the opponent to chris mays in the aji race

and is an election denier. there's been frustration with individuals like tyler bowyer and kelli ward as well who came in and sort of had this revolution. they ousted the likes of john mccain, they ousted jeff flake. kelli ward ran in the republican primary and jeff flake dropped out because he was losing in polling to kelli ward. all of these years later, these folks effectively took over the party, are still effectively running the party, there allies are the ones running for office here and there is little in kari lake's senate run here is evidence of this, it is the same allies of these very individuals that we are naming in this indictment here, along with folks like boris epshteyn, who is interested in this, who

continues to be the lead counsel advisor, legal advisor for donald trump's 2024 campaign, all of these folks are still very much in the game. it is not just a matter of 2020 as a bygone era, making good on trying to bring justice to past actions, these are folks that are still intimately involved with what is happening over the next six months ahead of the 2024 elections. >> to that end, lisa, what do you foresee as the handshake between the georgia case and the arizona case, given the overlapping defendants in both? the fact that jenna ellis has pleaded out in georgia, does that suggest to you she will plead out here? what can we map from georgia onto arizona? >> it is difficult to say because the facts are different and some of the communications also are very different. one thing that strikes me, though, is who isn't here and that is a former president of the united states, who is not a defendant here. that leaves many people scratching their heads as to why not. i will venture one guess.

on thursday, that is tomorrow, the united states supreme court will hear trumps presidential immunity argument. he has made presidential immunity arguments not only in the federal election interference case but also in the georgia case, also in the florida case. one reason chris mays may not have indicted donald trump here is she wants to see how that plays itself out first and also give some of those indicted a chance to flip against the boss. >> just when you think the screw has turned all the ways it can, there is another turn of the screw. von hilliard, amazing reporting, deep arizona knowledge, deep cuts in the arizona election interference. really appreciate your time tonight. lisa rubin, stay with me. we have a lot more for you. coming up, trump has a new nickname tonight, unindicted co- conspirator number one. tomorrow, he will be back in a manhattan courtroom and known as defendant trump in his criminal hush money trial. we will have more on the former president's escalating legal dramas, coming up asked. asked.

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we are awaiting a ruling from the judge in donald trump's new york city hush money case on the issue of trumps gag order. prosecutors are asking for 10 $1000 or percent find, $1000.00 for each violation of the gag order. as they put it in court yesterday, that is all they are asking for as of now. prosecutors have made clear that while they are not yet seeking and incarcerated for penalty, meaning jail time for president trump's, the belief trump seems to be angling for just that. for what it's worth right wing media seems to be angling for that too. >> i would force them to throw me in jail if i were donald trump. the mug shot backfired, the

indictments have backfired. being a martyr in jail for maybe what a day, 24 hours, that would be good. >> if they put him in jail for his first amendment right, he will be like nelson mandela. >> will he be like nelson mandela ? anyway, right after the hearing on trumps gag order yesterday, right after trump was warned, again, if he kept breaking the rules of the gag order he could be thrown in jail, pretty much as soon as the court went to break and he was allowed to use his phone again, donald trump posted this to true social. highly conflicted, to put it mildly, judge juan merchan has put away my constitutional right to free speech. everybody is allowed to talk and light about me but i am not allowed to defend myself. this is a kangaroo court and the judge should recuse himself. while attacking the judge does not run afoul of the gag order, trump is clearly poking that there, running right up to the line of what is allowed. there is the legal side of this gag order and we will get some expert help unpacking that in

just a minute but there is also the media component here. yesterday in court, we learned the full story of how the national enquirer and donald trump were in cahoots, not just when it came to catching and killing stories about trump, like the stormy daniels story that is at the center of this case but also the explicit agreement between trump and "the national enquirer." "the national enquirer," with published glowing stories about trump and negative stories about his political opponents, one's inquirer would embellish or completely fabricate. trump and "the national enquirer" had an explicit symbiotic relationship. having access to trump gave her "the national enquirer" to readers what they wanted. "the national enquirer" helped trump however he wanted . just to be clear here, it was a totally unethical arrangement. but, it really seemed trump and the right wing and right wing media today are doing something

quite similar. there may not be an explicit agreement but there is certainly a symbiotic relationship here. and, that could really matter when it comes to this gag order. from the very beginning of this trial, right wing media has been repeating trumps lies about this case, even the small stuff, like claiming that the judge barred trump from going to his son's high school graduation. in reality, the judge as you get to make a decision on that request. in ways both big and small, right wing media has been diminishing trumps potentially illegal actions in this case and claiming that trump being prosecuted is the real injustice here. >> do you think this is just compensation for a nondisclosure agreement, which happens all the time in big businesses especially ? >> it was not wrong. you hire lawyers to solve problems, low yourself the problems, you pay them. that's it. >> you back up 2000 years and this is the kind of thing they

would do in the roman republic that led to the end of the roman republic. >> i beg to differ on that last point. trump has himself twice now had his aides print out a big stack of articles for him, articles he then waves around outside the courthouse timing the content of these articles vindicates him. >> these are articles that were over the last day and a half, very good articles. they say the case is a sham. it shouldn't be tried. andrew mccarthy. every one of them saying this is a nothing case. >> the people trump listed off there, gregg jarrett, andrew mccarthy, the authors of these articles trump says vindicate him, all of those people are fox news regulars, contributors, analysts, very likely paid by fox, and all of them are saying things that are wildly off from what the rest of the legal world has concluded about this case.

as much as donald trump is kicking and screaming about how he needs to be able to attack the witnesses and the prosecutors and the jury, as much as trump is claiming the judge must kill this gag order so trump can mount a proper public defense, does donald trump really need to do it himself? he sure seems to have plenty of other people doing that for him already. last week, right wing media, and in particular fox news host jesse watters, demonized individual members of this jury. one of the things prosecutors dissected specifically as one of the instances of trump breaking his gag order was trump quoting jesse watters and saying "they are catching undercover liberal activists leading to the judge in order to get on the trump jury." here is the thing. jesse watters didn't actually say that. trump added to the part that read in order to get on the trump jury. but, within hours, jesse watters directed trumps mistake for him , posting trumps incorrect version of the quote

to jesse watters's own twitter account, in effect, retroactively making his own words the words that trump wanted them to be. quite clearly and quite literally, they are heeding trumps calls. they are taking his line edits. what does a gag order mean when you have someone like this with a microphone? >> the guy needs exercise. he's usually golfing. you are going to put a man who is almost 80 sitting in a room like this on his but for all that time? it's not healthy. he needs sunlight and he needs activity. they are going to put him in a meat locker. he says it's 45 degrees in there and they are putting his life in danger. >> back with me again is lisa rubin, msnbc legal correspondent and brian stelter, special correspondent and author of "network of life, the epic saga of fox news, donald trump, and the battle for american democracy." thank you both for being here tonight. brian, i don't know, what is

the point of a gag order, honestly, when you have a media industrial complex that is effectively acting as a public defense line for donald trump ? >> you are asking the right question. this was on my mind last week with the debates about the jurors and how much should media outlets be sharing about the jury. no matter how much was shared by nbc or the new york times or the ap, you will always have fox and the arts are outlets trying to intimidate jurors. now a week later, the same story is true when it comes to these witnesses. it is so important you are identifying this because we have to be able to see while we are on earth one, what is happening on earth two. a year ago, tucker carlson was fired by fox news. to the credit of fox, fox is a little bit less in crazy world. tucker believes in ufos and the connections to god. for jesse watters, trump is god and that is the programming every hour of every day. >> can ask you because you have been inside the fox complex or youth reported, you have deep

connections and have reported out from there , the arrangement between trump and the national enquirer was explicitly symbiotic. literally saying we want a story about ted cruz, go right one and "the national enquirer" would fabricate one. do you think that trump even, does he have the access to be able to have an arrangement like that at fox news? he communicates directly with sean hannity. >> he does with individual hosts, not with the network as a host. locklin murdoch is in australia a lot of the year. is not layered in the way his father rupert was with the way other moguls like david pecker was. locklin wants to keep the business humming and this is all about business. that is what is exactly the same with david pecker and the inquirer. this is about a financial relationship. they believe they have a fiduciary , they believe this is the responsibility they have to the shareholders, to keep the pro-trump propaganda going, to keep the viewers watching

and then you will see on the air on fox when they interview voters, the voters are saying the exact same things jesse watters is saying. >> it is a feedback loop . from a legal perspective, this seems like terra incognito, to some degree. i was struck by last week when the jurors, multiple jurors were saying i am worried about my safety. judge juan merchan set i'm directing the press apply common sense and refrain from writing about anything that has to do, for example, with physical descriptions of the jurors. that is not necessary, it serves no purpose. he is asking the press and that included the mainstream press, frankly, is his ability to circumscribe the amount of information put out there as it concerns the press reduced to just request or is there anything legally he can do to guard against this ? >> many of us in the past were in that room, took those requests more as a directive, as he continued in that court transcript. it became clear it wasn't

really much of a request at all and there were some people in the room bristling at what they perceived was an incursion on their first amendment rights. that being said, i want to go back to something you and brian were discussing about the feedback loop. i do think there is a point to the gag order in that you are cutting off some of that feedback loop. the trump of it all, which is to say one of the things that struck me was trump took something he liked that jesse watters said at 5:00, he added to it and made it more insidious and three hours later, that everything comes back out of jesse watters's mouth. to the extent that the gag order succeeds in interrupting some of that feedback loop where trump gets and find by conservative media but also is taking from conservative media and that stack of articles, the things that he likes, that might be a good thing, particularly when the das office is arguing republication is a violation of the gag order in and of itself, which is something that trumps lawyer argued to the contrary. the gag order prohibits making statements or directing others to make statements. it doesn't prohibit publication. the das office almost laughed at that and said your honor, this isn't a totally fair analogy but deformation along

prohibits republication. if you can be held liable for republishing somebody else's lies, why is it okay for him to do it in the context of this gag order ? >> when he is sharing the slides from fox, he's misinforming himself as well as his fans. he's actually hitting a warped sense of this trial, of the surroundings, of why his fans aren't showing up to the courthouse, which cracks me up that he thinks thousands are being denied entry when no one really wants to come. he's being misinformed, which really hurt his presidency and has hurt his post-presidency as well. all of us in our lives, we need someone to tell us the truth, to us when we have catch up on our tie or when there's a die dripping down her face. it doesn't seem trump has that person. instead, he has the opposite. he has the people that lied to him on television every day and every night and i would argue that hurts him. >> you think removing him from part of the feedback loop changes the mendacity over at fox? jesse watters came up with

these jerome conspiracies independent of donald trump. donald trump theoretically just retweeted and edited version of what jesse watters came up with and i wonder does the toxicity level decrease at all if the gag order is more punitive ? >> if it is enforced, which is the other thing. i want to point out something to you because the dynamic between judge juan merchan and trump is a parallel to the dynamic between trump and judge kaplan, who oversaw post- tran25 trials. everything from an nbc news article, where at the last trial, he said "mr. trump, i hope i don't have to consider excluding you from the trial. i understand you are very eager for me to do that." as trump was walking out of the courtroom, i remember him pounding the table, i would love that, i would love that. that is the dynamic that is going on with judge juan merchan. the trick for him is to hold out the stick without actually hitting trump with it.

>> that something, we started this segment talking about the ways in which trump is running right up to the line, right wing media saying go get arrested, sit in a cell for six hours, it is not only going to be great for your brand, it will be great for fundraising. we have details, trump raised $5.6 million in the first week of the hush money trial, an average of $1 million a day. he knows where his bread is buttered. >> it is so perverse that all of a sudden these law and order republicans care deeply about the humanity of the criminal justice system. jesse watters comparing trumps treatment to guantanamo bay prisoners. i fantasize that we will see some movement as a result to actually improve the prisons and the courthouse is. it's not going to happen but it is incredible to see how they are waking up all of us at and what it is actually right to be a criminal defendant. >> as it concerns one particular person who might face jail time.

>> that is what this about. they are worshiping their cult leader. >> why haven't we gotten a ruling from judge juan merchan on the gag order yet >> judge juan merchan is a very, very careful jurors. he said yesterday at the end of the hearing he wanted the parties to give him any additional authority they wanted to bring to his attention. you will recall he invited todd blanche to cite caselaw to him that said, essentially, that republication was not a violation of the gag order. he did not. both parties have an invitation to give him more between tuesday night and today. i expect we will see something from judge juan merchan tomorrow or friday in writing that he will read from the bench and then make available for the public to see. in the meantime, the da office has told us they are going to file a third order to show cause with respect to additional statements and then just yesterday, while we were at the trial, donald trump, i guess before the trial, must have done an interview with a news outlet in which he said some of the same things about michael cohen that have gotten him in this pickle in the first

place. the escalation is happening even before the verdict or the ruling comes out on these existing violations. >> poking the bear, quite literally. hopefully the guardrails will narrow tomorrow when the trial begins again with david pecker on the stand. lisa rubin, brian stelter, thank you both for your time. still ahead tonight, i will talk to congresswoman ilhan omar about the protests on gazan heating up on campuses across the country. tomorrow morning, the supreme court will finally hear arguments on the question donald trump helps is his get out of jail free card. is he immune from prosecution for everything he did while he was president? that is next. is next.

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tomorrow morning at 10:00 a.m., the supreme court will hear oral arguments in donald j trump versus the united states. that is the case that will decide whether trump can claim presidential immunity for his actions in and around the 2020 election and election subversion. and, therefore, have his federal election interference case dismissed. now, this case is effectively frozen since december as the appeals process here has dragged on, to the chagrin of anyone hoping the high court might expedite its ruling. seven weeks ago, the supreme court decided to add this case

to the end of his current term, which could mean that its decision may not come down until as late as july. the mere fact that the supreme court chose to take up this case in the first place sickly guaranteed some kind of delay and that, in the end, it may be the most significant result of this appeal. here is "rolling stone," describing team trumps attitude on the eve of oral arguments. "team trump is ready to lose the supreme court immunity case. they are celebrating. donald trump's inner circle doesn't expect the supreme court to go along with his extreme argument about executive power in the immunity case before the justices. but, we already pulled of the eyes, says a source close to trump." joining us now is margaret joseph stern, senior writer covering the courts and the law for "slate magazine." mark, thank you for being here tonight. first off, what are your expectations for oral arguments tomorrow and do you have any sort of, i don't know, game

strategy as far as what the conservative and liberal justices might do in terms of question and answer ? >> i don't think the liberal justices are going to go as hard as some of us might like to see at trumps attorneys. i think the number one goal will be to get john roberts, brett kavanaugh, and amy coney barrett on board with the decision that is quick and firm and can be sent back down to the lower courts to kick this trial back into motion. now, with those three conservatives, they are clearly the ones to watch. i think thomas and samuel alito have staked out a strong program position, neil gorsuch is somewhere in between. i think that for chief justice roberts especially, he probably recognizes at this point what that article pointed out, which is that team trump has pulled off the heist. the supreme court has slow walk to this case as compared to the ballot removal case from earlier this term, the nixon

cases in the 1970s during watergate. they have in short, i think, that this trial will not happen before november, before election day. and, you know, when john roberts is embarrassed by a case for sometimes he goes quiet, he doesn't say anything. one thing i will be looking to is whether the chief justice mostly keeps his mouth shut or whether he tries to direct arguments toward some kind of consensus position. >> i know that this supreme court is "impenetrable and they don't pay attention to press." and they are not victim to whatever the political climate of the day is. but, do you think the widespread public outcry over the slow pace with which they have taken this up, the fact they took it up at all to begin with, will inform the timeline upon which they rule? do you think they are going to expedite their ruling at all, if not the actual hearing question >> i do not and i will tell you why. the rule at the supreme court is that as long as a dissenter is still writing his or her opinion, the court will not release the ruling. that was put to the test after the draft decision in dobbs

leak, the decision overturning roe versus wade. we know some of the conservative justices best to release that decision quickly while the dissenters will still writing but the majority decided to honor that tradition and not release it until the end of the term. i think that tradition will hold here as well and what that means is that it effectively gives samuel alito and clarence thomas an opportunity to help out the clock for trump. they might take longer than they really need to in writing their dissent, drag this out until the end of june, perhaps the beginning of july, and, in effect, push this trial date back even further. there's really nothing that the other justices can do about that. i do not think we should expect a quick turn ruling. >> and we talk about clarence thomas? his wife was a poster of the big lie. he has offered to recuse himself from this. thomas has been speaking more from the bench than he usually does. on something like this, where he so clearly, well, he apparently has may be a conflict of interest or

shouldn't maybe be ruling on it at all, would you expect he will be vocal tomorrow ? >> absolutely. clarence thomas superpower is shamelessness. we saw this last week with the big january 6th case about obstruction charges filed against 350 of the january 6 writers, as well as donald trump. clarence thomas was leading the charge, arguing that these instruction charges brought against the rioters was illegitimate. he was accusing the justice department recently engaging in selective prosecution, of whipping out this arcane statute just to use against political enemies. he was out front and center in really criticizing the justice department's strategy of prosecuting january 6th insurrectionist. i don't think he has any shame about this. i don't think he ever considered recusing it if he takes the procomp stance in this case, he will be very vocal, he will attempt to lead the court in that direction, and he will not feel any sense

of reticence just because his wife tried to overturn the election and was, of course, present for trump's speech on january 6. >> a real moment, a real crisis point for the credibility of this court as it decides some major cases this term. we will see what tomorrow holds. mark joseph stern, great to talk to you, thanks, my friend. >> thank you. coming up, as the right- wing tries to oust him, house speaker mike johnson today found time to visit columbia university and demand someone else be fired, this time over pro-palestinian protests. coincidence ? congresswoman ilhan omar joins me to discuss right after the break. e break. i know, i've bee telling everyone. baby: liberty. oh! baby: liberty. how many people did you tell? only pay for what you need. jingle: ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ baby: ♪ liberty. ♪ everybody wants super straight, super white teeth. they want that hollywood white smile. new sensodyne clinical white provides 2 shades whiter teeth and 24/7 sensitivity protection. i think it's a great product. it's going to help a lot of patients.

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. as a matter of political strategy, do you see a connection between the fact the far right maga caucus is trying

to oust speaker johnson? >> no. it's very much of a coincidence. this is a man who is holding onto his speakership. he knows he might be on the chopping block and it's not surprising he would go out to columbia university and stir up really more anger and hate and endanger the lives of young people who are in the encampment at columbia university. >> do you have a theory? i have a theory, but the way in which the right wing has almost even taken it out of the like debate over free speech/anti- semitism and made this a war against "liberal elites," i have to call out hypocrisy on josh hawley who is calling for the national guard to be pulled

in over the protests and the same josh hawley with the january 6th rioters outside the capitol. how do you explain the discrepancy between the way they saw those individuals and these individuals? >> it's a complete clown show. these people do not care about violent protests. they don't care about 1st amendment. they care about their performing their political theater, which is what they most of the time do. these are people who supported insurrectionists on january 6th who threatened my life and the lives of all of our colleagues, who threatened the peaceful transfer of governance. it is really astonishing that they want to be taken seriously today as they call for the national guard to come in. this is also a group of people who are first to criticize

other countries as authoritarians when they call in the military to crack down on peaceful protests and people who are speaking up for their rights, people who are standing up for human rights, speak who are speaking up against their government utilizing their own resources, their tax dollars, to help in what now has been considered a genocide that israel is carrying out against the people of gaza. i want people to actually understand why these kids are risking their academics and their ability to stay in good standing at their universities. they are worried what it means to grow up in a world where people can watch nearly 35,000 people be killed, to watch nearly 70% of them be children and women, to watch the

destruction of 80% of infrastructure, to see a country withhold water, food, electricity to starve people and carry out collective punishment. israel's being hauled in front of the international courts and being accused of genocide. these kids don't want us to be complacent. they don't want their tax dollars to be complacent and for the member who said don't waste your parents' money, they don't want their parents' money to go in supporting a genocide that they oppose. so i do believe that history is going to be on their side and these members who think this is a political opportunity to turn the world against these people who are standing for a morally just, right cause are going to be looked at and mocked in history. >> i know that you recently visited an encampment at university of minnesota. your daughter was expelled from

-- arrested and suspended from barnard last week for being involved in protests at that campus. the senator says this solidifies the democrat party as the pro terrorist party. what is your response to an accusation like that? >> i can't consume him. he's not going to use me to get into good standing with his conference. this is probably one of the worst whips to exist in the history of congress. what i did was stand in solidarity with young people who are anti-war who don't want their resources being utilized for war. what emmert does is stand with insurrectionists and believes that it is okay for his conference to visit january 6th insurrectionist prisoners and call them political dissidents. this whole conference is a joke and nobody should take them seriously. >> in the meantime we are

seeing widespread protests outcry for what is happening. thank you again for your time and thoughts on this. >> as we should. thank you for having me. we'll be right back. save hundreds on car insurance with liberty mutual. we got a bit of a situation. [ metal groans] sure, i can hold. ♪ liberty liberty liberty liberty ♪ in theaters now. the virus that causes shingles is sleeping... in 99% of people over 50. it's lying dormant, waiting... and could reactivate. shingles strikes as a painful, blistering rash that can last for weeks. and it could wake at any time. think you're not at risk for shingles? it's time to wake up. because shingles could wake up in you. if you're over 50, talk to your doctor or pharmacist about shingles prevention.

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a quick programming note for you, in just 12 hours the supreme court will hear oral arguments on donald trump's claim that he is immune from all prosecution. msnbc will air the full audio of those arguments starting live at 10:00 a.m. during those arguments trump himself will be sitting for the third day of testimony in his manhattan hush money trial. so tomorrow night it's a bonanza. we will have special coverage of both of those big trump trials led by my colleague rachel maddow at 8:00 p.m. do not miss it. that's our show tonight. now it's time for "the last word" with lawrence o'donnell. good evening, lawrence. >> good evening. just when we thought the big