fighting for them and taking on the corporate greed that exists out there. that's what the democrats should be doing. if they do that, biden is gonna win this election in a landslide. >> good to see you, as always. thank you for spending time with us tonight. vermont senator bernie sanders. we appreciated. that's our show for tonight. alex we'll be back next. week you can catch me this weekend on velshi this weekend. time now for the last word with jonathan capehart, in for lawrence o'donnell. jonathan, you and i used to have fun in the old days when my show came before yours, because i would come untied to you and i'd be in the whole thing. that we don't get. this time you and i get to chat. >> i know. and it bums me out. but you know what? i keep hope alive. >> i appreciate that my friend. you have a great show. >> all right, ali, thank you very much. the reality of the criminal indictment in georgia is settling in for donald trump after having his mugshot taken for the first time last week, today donald trump waived his right to appear at his arraignment on wednesday at

9:30 a. m., pleading not guilty to the 13 criminal charges against him for trying to steal the 2020 presidential election in georgia. the document he signed acknowledges, quote, i fully understand the nature of the offenses charged. today, jenna ellis, one of the lawyers spreading election lies on donald trump's behalf, also pleaded not guilty and waved her right to appear at her arraignment. donald trump is also now trying to sever his case from the two co defendants who have requested a speedy trial. ken chesebro, one of the architects of the fake electors scheme, as a trial date scheduled for october 23rd. sydney powell powell also requested a speedy trial, but that date has not been set. this comes after fani willis asked the judge to advise those defendants demanding a speedy trial of the limitations on the

discovery process writing, quote, by filing a statutory speedy trial demand, the defendants elected to proceed to trial without the benefit of the type of prior notice of the states discovery and similar transaction evidence that would have otherwise been afforded to them. similarly, that decision also cost the defendants the use of any evidence not timely served upon the state. we also know now, once the proceedings begin they will be televised and livestreamed. judge scott mcafee confirmed today that cameras will be allowed in the courtroom for all hearings and proceedings relating to the georgia interference case. the judge overseeing former white house chief of staff mark meadows request to move his case to federal court could make his ruling anytime now. today at five pm, just turning fani willis's team and lawyers for meadows both filed new briefs explaining their answers to this question posed by the court on tuesday. would've finding that at least one, but not all, of the overt

acts charged occurred under the color of meadow's's office, be sufficient for federal remover of a criminal prosecution? lawyers for meadows argued that the alleged crimes were part of his job as donald trump's white house chief of staff, and as such that means the case should be tried in federal court. any country rule would lead to observe results a state could charge even the most quintessential official act and defeat removal by tacking on unofficial conduct. but district tierney willis had a simple answer. no. she argues that not only where the actions of mark meadows listed in her a night with outside the scope of his official duties, d. a. willis

says his actions must be viewed in the context of the conspiracy instead of just one over overt act writing, quote, the defendant conspired not for any purpose related to his duties as chief of staff, but to transform mr. trump from a losing political candidate into a winning one, no matter what the like outcome of the election had actually been. a finding that as part of that conspiracy, the defendant may have committed one or even several acts that fell within the color of his office would not demonstrate that he was being prosecuted for an act for or related to his office. d. a. willis also notice that mark meadows has been forced to admit under oath that he did play a role in coordinating the fake electors scheme and her previously testifying that he did not. in response to that, leading former defense department special counsel ryan goodman said, quote, mark meadows has the potential perjury problem. also in georgia today, we saw the release of the transcript of nearly five hours of testimony given by mark meadows earlier this week. in his testimony, meadows made this sweeping claim about the protections afforded him

because he was acting on donald trump's behalf. prosecutor, is there anything, anything that you did at the direction of then president trump that is outside the scope of your responsibilities as chief of staff? meadows, i don't know that i did anything but with outside of my schoolbus chief of staff. in regards to the infamous trump phone call to georgia secretary of state brad raffensperger, mark meadows tried to explain it was designed to find a little to just way to resolve or don't trump falsely claimed this voter fraud in georgia. prosecutors pressed him on that point, asking, quote,'s settlement of pride litigation, does that have any federal purpose? meadows, when that litigation involves elections, i saw it as part of my role as the chief of staff to try to deal with that. the president gave clearance direction and wanting to deal

with it. did i get involved in other litigation matters, generally not. mark beto's also appeared to inadvertently admit that he was acting for the campaign in this exchange from the transcript. meadows's attorney, why did you care whether the electors were coordinated? meadows -- it was mentioned to me that should a court or should a legislature rule that you can't just have one set of electors, you had to have a provisional set. and what i didn't want to happen was for the campaign to prevail in certain areas and then not have this. leading off our discussion tonight is andrew weissmann, former fbi general counsel and former chief of the criminal division in the eastern district of new york, he is a professor at nyu law school. and co-host of the podcast

prosecuting donald trump. joyce vance, former u.s. attorney and a professor at the university of alabama school of law. they are both msnbc legal analyst. also joining, us amy lee copeland, a criminal defense attorney and former georgia federal prosecutor. thank you all for being here. joyce, let's start with these findings from just attorney willis and lawyers from mark meadows. which of the two filings did you think was strongest, and what is jones gonna be looking for in these filings? >> sure, there's a little bit of a feeling of two ships passing in the night here. while meadows lawyers are focused on proving that the overt acts that he committed were in some cases part of his official duties and so they argue that the case, the whole case, should be removed to federal court. they don't confront willis's argument, which is that the charge is a conspiracy to violate the rico act. the court's value waiting

whether that charge, in its entirety, should be removed to federal court. so the arguments that meadows makes about individual overt acts, whether they were within the scope of his duties as chief of staff or not, are largely irrelevant. her argument is much stronger than his is here. this is something that typically courts don't consider in removal issues, because the typical case is a federal law enforcement agent who is charged with something that happens while he's executing a search warrant or she's executing arrest warrant. the court doesn't have to consider whether or not that was part of their official duties because it clearly wise in the law enforcement cases. here this is a very important consideration and something that judge jones, i suspect, we'll look at very carefully.

it may ultimately be the reason he sends this case back to state court. >> andrew, district attorney willis wrote this about mark meadows today in a new filing. after insisting that he did not play any role in the coordination of slates of fake electors throughout several states, the defendant was forced to acknowledge under cross examination that he had in fact given direction to a campaign official in this regard. andrew, how bad is this for meadows? >> it's not good, in two ways. in addition to the claims that joyce so eloquently summarized, because it's a difficult legal area, it's very complicated and no one better than joyce to try and get it concise and understandable. but in addition to the legal issue there's a factual issue, which is, do you believe mark meadows when he testified and said, oh no, i was doing this all within my role as chief of staff, this is why i was privately wanting to, quote, land the plane, meaning i wanted to see a treat peaceful transfer of power. i don't think he is going to be bound by the judge to be credible, and it's also the case that if you lie on one thing and the judge can throw out that testimony on that item, but also disregard your testimony altogether, he really, having reviewed everything now,

i don't think comes off is a terribly thoughtful witness or terribly careful. he is a wonderful defense lawyer. i'm sure they tried to prepare him a lot. and it really showed that he was not terribly prepare-able, because he made a lot of mistakes in his testimony. i think he really hurt himself. and the part that you have quoted, jonathan, is four from the redirect examination. that's when his own lawyer got to ask him questions and he actually kept digging, and made it worse. >> oh, man. wow. wow, andrew. and lucky we got you in. here we finally get our hands on the transcript from mark meadows hearing on monday. what's your biggest take away? >> hey, jonathan. i read it, and when you read it and when the viewers read it, the wheels start falling off and about page 100. he holds it together fairly well, gives a fairly engaging account of what he does is chief of staff. he just does everything, he

works all the time. and then we you spoke to, him some of the things that he has said earlier, he just can't hold together. he really has no idea what the presidential duties are in elections under article two. he kind of takes a pass on it. and as it goes, he's trying to dig himself out of a hole with a shovel is how this reads. he just continues to make it

worse until, again, his attorney tries to save him and page 148, which is what y'all were looking at. he manages to volunteer like, oh no, i was just trying to help the president, trying to help the campaign. i forget his exact words. but it's just not good. >> it also makes me think, isn't it a hatch act violation? but that's a whole other conversation. joyce, codefendant race smith filed a motion to sever tonight, with a specific request to break the defendants into, quote, manageable groups so the case can be presented and reasonable bites i segments that a jury will be able to

understand and assimilate in a reasonable amount of time. choice, what do you think the judge will make of this request? >> well, i read the request, and it doesn't make a lot of sense, because these are all defendants in one rico charge. no matter how you slice and dice, them fani willis still has to come up for eagle violation. what you're asking for is a set of different trials for different tranches of defendants. perhaps there's a different nuance to the evidence, based on which defendants are involved in which case. but what you really suspect is going on here is a little game of musical chairs where no one wants to be the defendant and ends up who wants to go to trial with donald trump. every defendant in this case will be concerned about sitting at the defendants table with the former president there. it's a bad look for any defendant and something all of them will want to avoid here. >> andrew, judge mcafee confirmed today that the proceedings in this case will be televised. how important will that be for the average american's ability to follow and understand the case against trump and his codefendants? >> as we have said, that's the major difference between the georgia state case and all of the other cases, certainly the federal january 6th case and the mar-a-lago case, because unless the chief justice of the united states changes the rules,

they're not going to be televised court proceedings. for a case that involves the former president, and where he has fomented so much mistrust and misinformation about the proof here, i think it's absolutely imperative for our country, for people to see it in the same way that heavily january six hearings will public was important, or to date myself, the watergate hearings. it's those kinds of defining moments that are important for people to be able to hear it. i suspect that one of the reasons, it may be the most important reason that you are seeing this fight go federal, is to take the georgia case federal, is to because it will lead to there being no cameras in the courtroom because if you're donald trump or mark meadows it's much easier to spin the facts to the public

when they can't see the actual proceeding itself. >> amy lee, let's speak about these speedy trial requests. district attorney fani willis's request says the judge informed the defendants about the impact of requesting a speedy trial. what impact will that have on the discovery phase? >> all discovery is do ten days before trial, otherwise you just can't use it. that's what she's defend transmitting to the defense attorneys. the arraignments are scheduled to take place on tuesday. a lot of people are awaiting formal arraignment, which means are just filling out of a. foreman entering a not guilty plea. she is scheduled to deliver discovery to everyone under september 15th. if they give her a two terabyte hard drive. by october 13th, if you are mr. chesebro you requested the trial to start october 23rd. then you better be ready to go within four weeks after you get all the discovery. >> and joyce, today, georgia

governor brian kemp pushed back against calls from other republicans in the state for a special legislative session to impeach fani willis. watch. >> up to this point, i had not seen any evidence that d. a. willis's actions or lack thereof warrant action by the prosecuting attorney oversight commission. regardless, in my, mind a special session of the general assembly to end run around this law is not feasible and may ultimately prove to be unconstitutional. the bottom line is that, in the state of georgia, as long as i am governor, we are going to follow the law and the constitution. regardless of who it helps or harms politically. and in georgia we will not be engaging in political theater that only inflames the motions of the moment. >> joyce, that's rare to hear from a republican these days. >> governor kemp can read the

writing on the wall. he knows that donald trump is about to get to the find out part of this entire little adventure. so, there is a part of me that says he's differentiating himself from other potential republican presidential candidates, not in this cycle but in the next one. he will be the candidate of law and order. he will be the candidate who stands for the constitution. i'd love to take him at his word. here i think it's an important statement at face value. there is still this new georgia state law that could involve procedures for removing d. a.'s. we've seen that happen to do to d.a.'s in florida. under a similar law i hope governor kemp will take this similar constitutional stance if there's an effort to use that new law to remove fani willis down the road. >> joyce vance, you've given me and you face, the find out portion. joyce vance, andrew weissmann, amy lee copeland, thank you all

very much for coming to "the last word". when we come back, after two mass shootings, one in north carolina and another florida just days apart, the biden administration is taking new action to combat gun violence. democratic congressman but maxwell alejandro frost joins me next. join me next. when moderate to severe ulcerative colitis takes you off course. put it in check with rinvoq, a once-daily pill. when i wanted to see results fast, rinvoq delivered rapid symptom relief and helped leave bathroom urgency behind. check.

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reeling after yet another mass shooting, the biden administration is taking a major step to address gun violence. >> today, as a result of that executive order that the president signed, and also the bipartisan safer communities act that the department of justice is taking lifesaving action to reduce the number of guns sold without background checks and keep guns out of the hands of criminals. now this action that a majority of americans want to see, a majority of gun owners also want, and it's just common sense. >> today the justice department announced a plan to close the

so-called gun show loophole. the proposed rule says that people selling firearms at gun shows or online would, quote, be presumed to be engaged in the business of dealing in firearms, and therefore be required to become a licensed firearm sieler and run background checks if they meet certain conditions. their bureau of alcohol, tobacco, firearms and explosives estimates that the rule would effect anywhere from 24,500 to 328,000 people. despite the country experiencing two deadly gun tragedies within days of each other, the doj's plan is likely to be challenged in court by the gun lobby. in a statement, vice president kamala harris said, in part, quote, it is a false choice to suggest that we have to choose between either supporting the second amendment or passing reasonable gun safety laws. we can do both. all people in every community across our nation have a right to be safe.

this proposed regulation will help realize that goal and save lives. joining us now, democratic congressman maxwell alejandro frost of florida. he is a member of the house oversight committee. congressman frost, great to see you again. thank you for coming to the last word. what is your reaction to the doj's proposed rule closing the so-called gun show loophole? >> i'm extremely happy about the news. and when we found out about this morning, i just went back ten years ago to when i first started getting involved in the fight to end gun violence. as a 15 year old who had saw on television what happened in sandy hook, connecticut, at the elementary school, there ten years later were not as far as we'd like to be, but this is a huge step forward. and when we talk about democrats stepping into our power and using our power, this is what we're talking about. this type of action will save lives. this type of action will show

people that government can work for them. and it's exactly what we've been fighting for. this executive action, and this direction that the president has given to the atf well essentially and the gun show loophole that gun violence prevention activists and the entire movement have been -- for a long time. so thank you to the president for this but also thanking the activists, organizers, survivors, and families who have been calling for for a long time. this is a huge step forward for our movement, and we have a lot more to do. >> on monday unc chapel hill was in lockdown for more than three hours after an armed graduate student shot and killed an associate professor. the entire front page of the school student newspaper is covered with text messages sent and received by students during lockdown, including one that red, i wish these never happen. congressman, i also want to play this interview with the u. n. c. student. >> this is a situation that we really shouldn't even have to be worrying about. we are in class and lecture we

have to be concerned about gunmen coming into our classrooms and hurting people, when we're just here to learn. like anybody should be able to. so, i'm very angry about this. something needs to be done. >> congressman frost, your you are a member of the lockdown generation. what do you tell your generation about what is and isn't being done in congress? >> we have to be honest. the fact of the matter is there have been so many mass shootings this year. and you know, jonathan, i've been asking myself this question since i got involved in this war. will this one be enough? will this be the one that pushes politicians to care more about profits for the gun lobby than human lives and the lives of our children? and after every shooting i continue to be disappointed. so, no, i don't have faith in this current republican-led united states congress with speaker kevin mccarthy. i do not have faith that a, we will be able to pass a legislation, so that's how more than ever we need the administration to step into their power and do it is to be

done. that's why i'm so happy to see that today. but the fight isn't over. i always like to say, if our timeline ended at the end of this congressional session, things would look a lot more grim than they are, but our timeline doesn't end. there this is a long haul. it's a battle. we will take back the house, we will ban assault weapons, we will ensure that we pass common sense gun reform. we will send it to president biden's desk and he will sign it and that will save lives. and what gives me so much hope is that this generation isn't just sitting around and waiting. young people are voting now in higher numbers than ever in our country's history. so we have to continue to pour resources and messaging and speaking and meeting young people where they are at and saying, to solve the climate crisis, to end gun violence, to ensure housing for all people, these are the folks we need to elect. elected officials that give a

damn about our lives. i think now more than ever, i -- -- watch for the silence from a lot of these elected officials when people die, like just a few days ago, when three black people were hunted down because of the color of their skin in jacksonville, florida. we have a lot of work to do, but we are going to get it done. we will end gun violence. >> congressman maxwell alejandro frost of florida. thank you for coming to "the last word" tonight. joining me now, adam serwer, staff writer at "the atlantic". he is the author of the cruelty is the point, why trump's america endures. adam, thank you for coming to the show. you have written a lot on the ties between gun violence and racism in america. the hatred tied to this kind of violence, specifically what we saw in jacksonville. where does that hatred still get safe harbor? or why does that hatred still get safe harbor in this country? >> the jacksonville shooting is yet another example of a

shooting by white supremacist extremism that has been cultivated in the dark corners of the internet. the logic of this extremism is that a society that does not have an explicit racial hierarchy with white people at the top is unjust. and that kind of logic leads, inevitably, to a kind of genocidal violence, which you saw on a small scale in jacksonville, that we have unfortunately seen fairly frequently since the shooting perpetrated by dylan roof in south carolina years ago, in 2016. in a country where guns are easy to get, they are going to be people who act on these kinds of beliefs, and obviously not all gun violence is rooted in this kind of ideology, but when guns are easy to get, people who have extreme ideas are going to get guns and they're going to use them in ways that everyone finds or abhorrent, or most of us finds, at least. >> and today, the guardian reported, quote, ongoing exposure to such acts of violence can have a compounding effect on black people,

according to experts. we do not have a quality infrastructure for supporting black americans with overwhelming racism and racialized violence that our communities experience, said jessica -- a psychology professor at suffolk university. is that something you've noticed, adam, in your own reporting? >> look, if you ask anybody who has been, who has had an experience of gun violence, anybody who has been around someone or known someone who has been, shot there is a tremendous amount of emotional trauma around that experience. and i can only imagine that that is compounded when you are targeted because of your race, religion, ethnicity. >> and adam, do we see a trend here upward or downward, or perhaps not at all, in the level of racially motivated gun violence? >> like i said, in a country like this, there is always --

where guns are easy to get, there are always going to be people who act on extremist beliefs. i think it's very hard to limit that kind of violence, unless you have rules that limit the sale of firearms so that they are not as easy for these kinds of people to get. and unfortunately, you have a gun industry that is opposed to any rule that would limit the sale of firearms, which would also limit their profits. and they have a politically powerful consumer base, that identifies with the industry's interest so strongly that they regard any such regulation is a violation of the rights. and so, the end result is that you have a congress that is unwilling to act politically to limit gun violence because they are beholden to an industry that does not want to see their profits fall, because a few less guns get sold. >> adam serwer, thank you for coming to "the last word" tonight. coming up -- florida governor ron desantis was booed while offering thoughts and prayers after a gunman killed three black americans in jacksonville. and now, new reporting reveals just how far the desantis

administration has gone in its fight against teaching black history in florida schools. that is next. that is next kids need. instead of spending more, he spent less. seemed obvious. why would a person spend more money? he's eight and he gets it. i'm 10. well, that's less impressive. i'll always take care of you. ♪ i'm gonna hold you forever... ♪

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saturday's racist attack in jacksonville, florida, where a white gunman shot and killed three innocent african americans, near at a historically black university,

florida governor ron desantis was booed during a vigil for those victims. >> florida governor, ron desantis is here. we're gonna ask the governor he would come up and -- >> win [crowd chanting] >> -- on your hands! but >> this was the first time that way governor desantis has faced jacksonville's black community since beginning his so-called anti woke campaign denying systemic racism as his administration pushes back against how schools teach the truth about slavery. and now, journalist with the miami herald and tampa bay times have uncovered new details on just how far the desantis administration's fight against black history has gone. according to a review of internal documents by the herald and the times, when florida officials decided to block ap african american studies from being taught in florida public high schools, they sought opposing views on slavery.

the herald and the times report, state officials said they objected to the study of several concepts, like reparations, the black lives matter movement, and queer theory. but in many instances it's reviewers also made objections in the states attempts to sanitize aspects of slavery and the plight of african americans throughout history. in one example, florida officials objected to the course's focus on how european benefited from trading enslaved people, and the labor they produce, saying the obstruction ill approach may lead to a viewpoint of an oppressor versus oppressed, based solely on race or ethnicity. the state also raised concerns that the course may not address the internal slave trade system within africa, and that it may only present one side of this issue and may not offer any opposing viewpoints or other perspectives on the subject.

look, there is only one side. one viewpoint, when it comes to slavery and it's this. enslaved people in america endured immense brutality and trauma for this country to have the wealth, and riches we see to this very day. joining us now to discuss this, professor david canton. he is the director of the african american studies program at the university of florida. professor canton, thank you for being here. first of all, your thoughts on this latest news on this ap african american studies in your state? >> thank you, jonathan, for inviting me. you are correct, there is only one side of slavery. when you talk about the holocaust, native american genocide, or japanese internment, there are no opposing viewpoints. we all agree that those were immoral. we believe that the u.s. government was incorrect, the

u.s. government was incorrect to do those atrocities. the nazi government was incorrect for leading holocaust. but somehow when it comes to slavery, the search for two sides, or opposing views is a discussion among many on the right. >> professor, governor desantis pledged one point $1 million for security at the -- where the jacksonville gunman stopped before going on a rampage. in a tweet, florida former florida state democratic senator audrey gibson called that, quote, blood money. what is your reaction? >> it's, again, we see -- the argument is about desantis's policies in the last few years. this anti-woke agenda, the attack on ap african american studies, i think, is creating a climate, or a chilling effect in the state of florida. and this money to the university in some way buys some sort of support for african americans with desantis. but people see through that,

and realize that unless you change these policies, whether it is gun laws, red flags, these instances are going to continue to occur, that's why i think african american studies are so important, to educate all americans on these issues about race based violence. race based slavery. that can somehow decrease these egregious acts of violence. >> florida also has new status -- that teaches some black people benefited from slavery because it taught them useful skills. here's how vice president kamala harris responded. >> they want to replace history with lies! middle school students in florida, to be told that enslaved people benefited from slavery. highschoolers may be taught that victims of violence, of massacres were also perpetrators.

i said it yesterday. they insult us in an attempt to gaslight us. and we will not have it. and we will not have it. >> [applause] >> professor, what will you say to future students who were taught about these benefits before reaching you in college? >> there were no benefits. obviously, slavery benefited western civilization, benefited america. created a -- amount of wealth for whites in the united states, in the west. so there really is no benefit. one way benefit by whites. but again, we will never say how jews benefited from the holocaust. how native americans benefited from genocide, how japanese benefited from internment camps. so, we have to get beyond this. we talk about slavery, that there are no opposing viewpoints, that black people did not benefit from slavery. and this argument is dead in the water.

>> and professor canton, last question for you. as an educator, what is the best way to push back against this kind of campaign against black history? >> like everything else, voting, we see the power of voting. particularly on a state level. so, i think, people are now seeing the power of board of education's. we are seeing the power of people organizing, and putting their perspective out there. so, we talk about campaigns, asking elected officials what are their views on education, what are their views about book banning? what are their views about african american studies? so, i think that is the way to push back, is through the ballot box, particularly the local and state level. >> professor david canton, thank you for coming to "the last word" tonight. when we come back, the biden administration is taking steps to expand overtime pay for millions of salaried workers across the united states. that is next. that is next

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protecting kids online. while our children are dying. we can pass the kids online safety act. join us. join us. join us. join us. ♪♪ let's lead the way. >> as we head into the labor day weekend, the biden administration is taking steps to make sure more americans get the money they deserve for putting in more than 40 hours a week at work. the department of labor announced plans to restore and extend overtime pay. what we all know as time and a half for lower wage workers who are currently not eligible for overtime. the release states, the proposed rule would guarantee overtime pay for most salaried workers earning less than $1,059 per week. about $55,000 per year.

that is an increase from the current overtime cut off of $35,500. president biden's acting labor secretary, julie su, said in a statement, the cornerstone of workers rights in this country is the right to a 40 hour work week. the promise that you get to go home after 40 hours, or you get higher pay for each extra our they spend laboring away from your loved once. the biden harris administration is proposing a rule that would help restore workers economic security, by giving millions more salaried workers the right to overtime protections if they earn less than $55,000 per year. workers deserve to continue to share in the economic prosperity of bidenomics. we are going to pick up this conversation with washington post columnist e. j. dionne. -- washington post columnist e. j. dionne, where it's about national politics. he's also a distinguished

university professor at georgetown. we thought we lost, you e. j., but here you are. so, e. j., for folks who don't know, why isn't everyone getting overtime? please explain why this rule is even needed, and how it will work. >> given our topic, i should wish you and our viewers a early happy labor day. and it will be a happier labor day for some of these workers. the way this works is, if -- before this rule change, if people were classified as say, assistant managers and put on salary, then they could be deprived of overtime. you are working at a restaurant, here they are at four in the morning cleaning up after a busy night. you are an assistant manager. under the old rule, the number was set at about 35,000 a year. so if you made a penny more than that, you couldn't get overtime. what the labor department under biden has done is raise that number two, as you showed,

about $55,000 a year. the labor department estimates that this means that 3. 6 million more people will be able to collect overtime. it does not matter if they call you an assistant manager, or a center fielder. if you earn less than 55 grand you will get the overtime. and i think this really underscores something that we don't think enough about when we vote at election time, which is, the government is not just the president. the government is all these agencies. the government is made up of the people who he appoints to boards and to departments. and, under biden, you have seen a whole series of rules changes that are pro labor, pro worker will changes. another example of a change they made earlier this summer's, they made it harder for employers to classify people who are really employees as

independent contractors. if you are an undependable contractor you can't unionize, you are not covered by basic labor law. they said, no, this is not fair, we are going to move a lot of these people into a situation where they are called employees, so they have access to these benefits. and if they want to join a union, they can try to organize a union. and of course, a broad array of areas. that's with the biden administration is doing. >> e. j., we know how workers will greet this news. but the wall street journal also notes, in the first year, the rule will cost employers 1.2 billion dollars to implement. the labor department estimates, in addition, the rule it will boost wages by 1. 2 billion dollars. will employers balk at the cost? >> i think all these rules are probably going to face litigation from employers, and there's another big rules change that they made that's going to make it easier for unions to get certified.

it will make it possible in a way that it really hasn't been for unions to organize, and all these rules are going to go to court. and there is a chance with a conservative judiciary that we have in many places that they may rule against them. but when you look at that number, are we supposed to mourn the fact that workers are going to get 1.2 billion dollars more in their paychecks? that is the whole point. yes, employers will have to pay more. i might have to pay you. i might have to pay a quarter or 25 cents more for a hamburger or something. i think that is okay if that means that people doing the hard work there in the restaurant are able to get overtime. >> once again, e. j. dionne, you and i are on the same side. e. j. dionne, of "the washington post", thank you for joining us tonight. we will be right back. ht back.

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he's a state fair. most of us have heard of the iowa state fair, which is known for presidential candidates eating fried food, and paying homage to all manner of things made a of butter. but this year, the minnesota state fair is getting its share of attention, as local politicians come out to support the community. earlier this week, senator amy klobuchar shared this picture, saying, you don't want to miss the minnesota firefighters. how are you doing?

congresswoman ilhan omar confirmed senator klobuchar's assessment of the firefighters, who are selling calendars for their department. all right now. and then, senator tina smith was literally swept off her feet, by the firefighters, you go girl. but it wasn't just all about the male firefighters, today, senator amy klobuchar was back at the fair to support the women firefighters selling their calendars. go ahead. the minnesota state fair ends on labor day. so, if you are close, do not miss your chance. and one programming note. i am back from vacation. so, coming up this weekend, first, on the saturday show at 9 am eastern, i will be joined by becca balint of vermont, as we discuss the latest on republican efforts to investigate those investigating donald trump. and then on the sunday show actor and activist wilson cruz

will join me to talk about all the workers across the u.s. demanding better pay, benefits, and working conditions. from actors to flight attendants, thousands are hitting the picket lines. join me this weekend on saturday and sunday shows, 9:00 am eastern right here on msnbc. that is tonight's last word. "the 11th hour with stephanie ruhle", starts right now. >> tonight, donald trump pleads not guilty in the georgia case, his push to break away from the other 18 defendants, as the judge pulls back the curtain, allowing the case to be livestreamed. and the long awaited financial disclosure from supreme court justice, clarence thomas. what was revealed about those luxury vacations? then, two proud boys leader sentence for the january 6th insurrection. we will get into the impact of accountability on extremist groups as "the 11th hour" gets underway on this thursday night.