with the release, the cravings are gone. golo worked for me when i thought nothing would work for me. the first few weeks were really astonishing how quickly and how easily it came off, how much better i felt, what a change it made so fast. i feel like anything is possible after accomplishing what i've done with golo. thank you so much for letting us into your homes during these truly extraordinary and historic times. we're so grateful. "the beat" with ari melber starts rites now.

ari, you're transformed yourself on to another floor, another studio, and we'll be back around the big set together. the magic of tv. >> i have been seeing you a lot and look forward to seeing you. >> have a great show. >> thank you. right now our coverage continues. today the justice department arrested, booked and arraigned donald trump. this is how trump looked today according to new court sketches we just got into your newsroom. since federal courts limit cameras, we are looking at the sketches. this is how we are seeing and learning about this very new breaking news event that spilled over the late afternoon. he's the first former president ever indicted by the former government he ran. this picture is the image that donald trump worked very hard to avoid people seeing. i'm going to leave it up on the screen and give you that context, because he is a former president, he is a politician, he's a candidate for office right now, and this image and

this moment is something that he has tried to crowd out, and i'll explain that. he has tried to flood the internet and the air waves with his version of sbefs attacks and threats and his own view of the indictment, which at times we cover when they're newsworthy. indeed you probably learned about this from a donald trump leak, because he leaked his own indictment news thursday night. that's a gambit which continued today. trump tried to create different press images, waving and showing his away en route to the miami courthouse where he was forced to surveillance render and taken into custody. today there was also even a campaign style stop. this was after the arraignment. i mention this for context. we're not playing a low of the sound from it. the two images you see on your screen. this plays out after what could be the trial of the century. on the left you have donald trump, the defendant, quiet, surrendering, out of control,

listening to a judge to define his future, whether he'll have a passport -- he will, whether he can walk to witness -- he can't -- and so on. on the right is a still of donald trump's unusual but perfectly allowed campaign style stop at a coffee shop known for political gatherings in miami. tonight we have a reporter on the left side who was inside that courtroom as well as our legal experts, and they're going to break down this historic arraignment. we saw trump today with his lawyers. we know that arraignment was fairly standard. ran about 47 minutes. trump standing quietly. reporter inside the room, and garrett's one of them, have said he was basically expression less or dower, often with his arms cross. he did not speak. it was a trump lawyer who entered the words not guilty as donald trump's plea trump is accused of conspiracy and his indicted codefendant was booked

as well, seen there with trump. that's mr. nota, a lesser known character, now the coconspirator. he was also seen, i should mention, in the car with trump as well as the courtroom because he still works for trump. both men seen with trump's legal team. here's a wider sketch of the historic booking of a former president today. the judge oversaw that booking and allowed trump to keep his passport for any travel but barred from discussing this case with witnesses like his codefendant, mr. nauta. this is donald trump's second arraignment in just over two months. that is another unprecedented reality that you can see in this breaking news comparison tonight. donald trump there captured by a camera, so you have that image, inside a new york city courtroom for this arraignment which was very historic at the time, a big deal, and today's federal arraignment.

what you see on the screen are the moments donald trump doesn't want to you see. both these cases involve a lot of alleged treachery, lies, obstruction, lying to your own lawyers, lying to the government, lying about business records on the right, lying about national security secrets on the left. the more cases that are speaking indictments, the courtroom proceedings, the evidence is amassed, the more people may learn just why two different jurisdictions have new turned this one-time president into a defendant. he doesn't want to you see this. we know that, which is why he wants you to see him at coffee shops or social posts. today donald trump was taken into custody, booked and told his rights, which includes the presumption of innocence in our system. there's also a difference between these two cases. the difference, in short form, is named jack smith. he showed up in that courtroom today. he watched his team go through

this arraignment from the front row. this is, again, a photo -- i'll tell you what we're doing while we do it. this is a photograph because we didn't get from the court artist any sketches of mr. smith in the first row as special counsel. i can tell you today is the first known time this prosecutor and this now defendant have been in the same room. reports are that donald trump did not look over at jack smith who has so upended his life, his campaign, perhaps his liberty, a single time during the 45 minutes he was required to be there. so in those images, again, you see the reality, what in court might be called the evidence of the facts, which sometimes is crowded out by so much other noise or the way that information and images and videos move around. some of that is what trump doesn't want you or anyone to see, and some of it is increasingly unavoidable.

i mentioned we have many experts lined up, but i want to begin one-on-one with david kelly, who is the u.s. attorney in the southern district of new york, a famed office, fill disclosure also my former boss. you and james comey and jack smith and mueller all have something in common, which is you usually try to let the work speak. is jack smith doing that? what did you see in broad strokes today? >> i think it's great that jack smith is not out there beating his chest and as you say, letting the facts speak for himself. he came out with a very meticulous, detailed indictment, letting the facts speak for themselves. facts that, by the way, were determined not by jack smith, but by a majority of 23 of donald trump's peers who sat on this jury on this case to whom the evidence was presented and who voted unanimously to indict, that there's probable cause that donald trump committed the crimes laid out in the

indictment. >> simple question, we're not afraid of asking the basic questions around here. you look at this you say, okay, why is jack smith there? why is he in the front row? >> i think it's important for him to be there instead of being kind of this person way in the shadows, you know, the man behind the curtain. let people know he stands behind his folks, that he's there, he's immersed in the case, he's on top of it. i it's important. >> finally, before i get to garrett, you have this background i mentioned. also have the background as a police officer. you have a history with law enforcement. what does it mean for americans to look up be see today that rueful of law is working and the defendant has rights but also a person who recently ran this government was today in the custody of this government? >> so, it's interesting because it's a historic day, obviously. it's a tragic day. because you've indicted the president of the united states. it's a tragedy, but at the same time it's a glorious day, the

celebration of democracy and most important, the rule of law. so it's all those things kind of combined into one, and it is truly surreal to see the chief executive, the former chief executive of the united states who oversaw, among other branches, the justice department, and now is there sitting there in the docks like any defendant. >> yeah, in the docks. we went big picture. i want to come back to you in more of the weed as we go through the hour. garrett haake, though has been standing by on his busy workload today. live outside the courthouse in miami. you were in the indictment. neal katyal is also with us. garrett, let's talk about what we saw in court today starting with what you could see inside the courtroom. we have the sketch of trump at the arraignment. we'll put this up as you walk us through what you witnessed. >> this is my second donald trump arraignment, and much like

the first i was struck by that inversion of the usual control that you guys were just talking about. i've covered donald trump as a businessman and as a president and former president. this is not someone who's used to being in place where is he is not in control, and the frustration, the irritation on his face, the body language, to be in that room was certainly palpable. we didn't see donald trump walk into the courtroom. by the time the reporters were brought in, he was already sitting there with the lawyers and secret service. i can't tell you for how long. and he was clearly frustrated by the fact. he sat with his arms tightly crossed over his body. i was sitting on the prosecution side of the room hem never turned his head in that direction. it was as though he was clear he was going to talk to his attorneys on either side quietly. he was going the talk to the judge. even when he left he look at the defense room. had he looked across the aisle he would have seen jack smith seated with the other prosecutors seated behind the prosecution table but with other

member of his team, who gave a completely different dynamic of somebody who was loose and in control. the end of the hearing jack smith went up and patted on the back, threw his arm around the lead prosecutor who had been handling the hearing. just a very different dynamic. the other piece i found interesting, again, having covered new york, new york was such a first, you could not see across the courtroom. there were more law enforcement officers than there were other people in the courtroom. there was three or four law enforcement officers between me and any of the principles in any direction i looked. the federal court system, they handle these higher profile defendants far more often. this felt in a weird way, if not normal, something you could at least picture. it did not have that same sense of being a totally alien environment as we saw in new york. no word yet on when the next hearing is going to be, but -- >> garrett, i'm going to jump in -- >> just clearly a different

functional environment here. >> i want to jump in and draw more out of what you saw, this specific moment. you had the judge giving the contact order. this is the one moment we learned something new today, and trump was basically told not to talk about the case with witnesses like his coconspirator nauta, who still works for trump. walk us through anything you gleaned from being in the room for that or how trump seemed to respond to that, and then neal can respond to that moment as well. >> this was interesting, because this was not an order that the prosecution asked for. the government made it clear they didn't have any special requests in term of conditions for bond for donald trump. this is something the judge himself -- the order came in two parts. first he said no specific contact about the case with walt nauta. the judge making it clear he understands walt is trump's body man, he cannot collect his paycheck without trump being around him.

they said they can't have contact about the facts of the case, but can still be in contact generally. then the judge asked the government provide a list of witnesses and victims who trump cannot have any contact with at all. the defense team objected to that. this was the bulk of the hearing going around and around about how an order like this can be put and practice when the defense believes most of the witnesses called against donald trump are people who work for him, including one of his attorneys or member of his protective detail. where they landed was the prosecution selection that the list should be very narrow, not a lot of names on it, and they would only be prohibited from discussing the facts of the case. the defense attorneys after posited this would be something difficult to enforce in practice when the people they're talk about are physically next to donald trump every day, the secret service detail, and the

staff who work for him at his various residences. garrett haake, i know you're running as you work tonight. thanks for joining us tonight. >> thank you. >> neal katyal still with us. we look at the sketches, look at the understanding of what happened in the no contact order as well. your thoughts on this historic night? >> yeah, so i think the no contact order is probably the one relatively unexpected thing. we knew today was going to be major in a sense, ari, because you have a guy who's a now former president who's been indicted two times, impeached two times and now today has been arrested two times, both at the state and federal level. and it's kind of bizarre to be discussing the details of his federal arraignment just after his state one in new york. it does -- everything about this indictment feels both unprecedented in one sense but also an odd sense of deja vu in another. so, what we expected today was this thing called arraignment,

which goes all the way back to the 14th century. it's the right to have the charges read with you present in the courtroom and for you to plea guilty or not guilty. and we expected trump to plea not guilty. he did. i think we did also expect his coconspirator, walt nauta, his valet to plead not guilty, but actually nauta couldn't enter any sort of plea of guilty or not guilty because he didn't have local counsel with him, so that's been delayed. then as you were discussing a moment ago, there was this whole discussion about whether or not trump should be forbidden from talking to other witnesses, especially nauta, about this criminal case. that's something the judge brought up on his own. i think that jack smith and his team didn't want to put restrictions on trump. they also said we're not going

to have financial bond or anything like that. that's the position smith came in with, but the judge took a position saying i think there should be restrictions here. and the bulk of the hearing was about that. i disagree with garrett a bit. it's possible to craft this. it's not that unusual to have a rule that says you can't contact each other. whether trump will follow it, like any court order or text of law is a totally different question, and it is important to note that, you know, nauta -- walt nauta arrive at the courtroom in donald trump's motorcade. trump is terriied that nauta is going to flip on him and trying to do, i suspect, everything he can to keep nauta in his orbit. >> you remind of us of that at almost a physical level. we've seen trump throw many people under the bus. here'st a far cry, he's in the motorcade, in the employ, and in the legal defense of the former

president. i'm telling viewers about what we get as we get it on a night like tonight. i showed some of the sketches we prepared. we just got a few more. as you can see here, these have a different look. these by william hennessey who was in the courtroom along with garrett, the hottest ticket in the country for journalists. what you see here is the courtroom artist version of this defendant in a federal courtroom. we're told he was referred to as the former president, neal. different than as the citizen defendant in new york. a federal building with federal officers might be more familiar to him and his team. taking notes today in his arraignment. is this justice department where you long served -- has done what it would not even under rule be allowed to do for a sitting president, which is follow tacts

and evidence and for the first time indict a former president. what does that mean for america tonight? >> first of all, the justice department's policy, which goes back to 1973, is a sitting president can't be formally indicted. you can still investigate the sitting president. indeed, that's what happened with mueller but then barr went and truncated the rest and said you couldn't indict because sitting presidents couldn't be indicted. those memos, the moment a president leaves office, you can indict him. the images you're showing on the screen, which i'm so glad your viewers are seeing, you're seeing the essence of the rule of law in realtime. you're seeing basically this principle that no one is above the law, which is kind of the foundation of the anglo-american legal system brought to you life before you. you can disagree about the strength of the case or whatever, but that's what the criminal process is designed to uncover, and in this criminal

process, trump is going to have all the advantages that every criminal defendant has, and our entire system is based on the idea that it's better to let ten guilty people go free than one innocent person be convicted, so the prosecution -- jack smith is going to have to show with respect to these charges that trump committed them beyond a reasonable doubt, which is the highest standard of proof in the law, and he's going to have to show that trump did so and convinced all 12 of the jurors. if one juror says no, his prosecution is over. >> yeah. neal katyal, keeping busy. thank you for being part of our special coverage here tonight. as mentioned, david kelly, the former prosecutor is still with me here. david, question i want to ask you when we come back here, is what happens next now that we have a judge? people know about her. we have this very important case, which also has national security information. so the question is, what are we actually going to see next, especially for people who are saying, hey you know what?

wake me when it really heats up? as if today wasn't enough for them. we have our shortest break. back in 6 a seconds. in 6 a sec. a "let's dig in" day... mm. ...a "chow down" day... a "take a big bite" day... a "perfectly delicious" day... - mm. [ chuckles ] - ...a "love my new teeth" day. because your clearchoice day is the day everything is back on the menu. a clearchoice day changes every day. schedule a free consultation. imagine you're doing something you love. rsv could cut it short. ♪ rsv is a contagious virus that usually causes mild symptoms but can cause more severe infections that may lead to hospitalizations... ...in adults 60 and older... ...and adults with certain underlying conditions, like copd, asthma, or congestive heart failure.

talk to your doctor and visit cutshortrsv.com. former president donald trump was arraign by the united states government today in a hearing that lasted 47 minutes, it was presided over by judge jonathan goodman. that's not the actual judge who will deal with this trial. it is the local magistrate. we are girding for the trial of the decade, if not the century. trump's allies and some of his team are talking off a flurry of motions and challenges that will, they say, among other things, potentially narrow or delay the trial. here's what trump's former lawyer in this doj case actually said just today on msnbc. >> rushing this thing to a trial doesn't necessarily make sense, because there are significant pretrial issues that should be

fully litigated that should officially avoid this case ever getting to a jury. the biggest issue, andy, is of course prosecutorial misconduct. >> that is someone who knows the defendant, donald trump, worked for him, and is giving you a larger ad hoc view of how you could go about this. they haven't put forward evidence of prosecutorial misconduct, delaying a trial interacts with the larger calendar. you have the election. donald trump's trial set for march 2024. one analysis says trump could face many years in prison if convicted and sentenced in the most aggressive fashion. donald trump and his team say he is not pleading and he will fight this and they expect to do this on two fronts in florida and new york, wherever else they need to go. former prosecutor david kelly is heretic and promised, what happens next, and what's the difference between the pretile

motions that they're entitled and a bank shot political calendar strategy? >> okay, so one of the rights he was read today was the right to a speedy trial. what happens now at the initial presentment is the clock starts. all right, and it's ticking. and what has to happen is things have to happen in a certain period of time. you get exclusions from the clock for complicated discovery and so forth, but what happens now is the government is going to make this discovery. we're dealing with classified informat things down if the judge knows what she's doing to move quickly through this because we're not dealing with a huge number of secret documents, we're dealing with a set that they know what there is. >> when will they be able to bring in their idea that, look, they say, and some americans are wondering, is this only because of his name, because he's donald trump?

>> prosecutorial misconduct, you do discovery, and then the defense has an opportunity to make motions to dismiss. if i'm a judge and i say, if you're talking about prosecutorial misconduct, make your motion know. i don't want to get too far down the road and we have to change the prosecution team. if you've got the goods i want to hear it now. if not, keep quiet, let's get moving with this case. i will put the heat on the government, get the discovery done, and then you get on a motion schedule. make a motion to dismiss, let the court rule on it, and you're off and running to set a trial date. >> yeah. it was a big deal when people saw a former president's residence was searched. there's questions was it an unauthorized raise, was it overkill? the speaking indictment, the fruits of the arraignment, shows quite the opposite, that the doj gave them offramps, was deferential, extra time even as

they were concerned the classifies documented were there. for people who don't want to follow facts, today doesn't mean anything to them. but some people predisposed to be critical of the initial search read this indictment and the facts and say uh-oh, this was well supported. take a look at fox's brett hume on that evolution. >> above all is his defiant refusal to turn the documents, all of them, over when asked to do so, and that is what led to that raid, which i initially thought was an overstep, but the details of this indictment turn out to be true, that raid was very much valid. >> he hits the nail on the head. the fact that distinguishes this ways from hillary clinton, from biden, from vice president pence is the obstruction. well, among other things. >> principally. >> principally, the obstruction. if he had complied with the request initially, we wouldn't be sitting here having this discussion now.

it's a big deal. they're going to get the search warrant affidavit as part of discovery, and they can move to suppress the evidence if those search warrants for obtained unlawfully or even executed improperly. i doubt that will be the case on either front. >> yeah. david kelly, i want to thank you for walking us through so much of that, the big picture, and also what we're going to see coming up if everyone's hearing, it wasn't misconduct, well, that is correct be litigated. thank you, sir. coming up, we turn to the classified documents issues, the fact check that we'll show you why people do hard time on this, the high conviction rate for federal defendants. first, next, as we have been doing all this shift work and sharing all of our reporting, i'm thrilled to tell you msnbc's lawrence o'donnell is our guest on all of this and the arraignment. next. arraignment. next er. now ports can know where every piece of cargo is. and where it's going. (dock worker) right on time. (vo) robots can predict breakdowns

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it's a big news night. our special coverage continues. lawrence o'donnell is here. we begin with the big question -- where were you on june 13, 2023? did you learn about it on your phone? were you watching on the tv or internet? did it feel larger or less exciting than you thought it might? if you lived in america with a pulse on the news the last six years you have discussed hypothetically whether donald trump could get in trouble for

all the things he seemed to do and get away with and whether he'd be arrested or booked and arraigned. maybe not by some random process, but by the big guns. the reason they say don't make a federal case out of it is if it's a federal case, it's already a big deal, even if you are, yes, legally -- when donald trump was arraigned when he pled not guilty the 47 counts when the federal processing played out, building on what he leaked to try to get ahead of it, what was unsealed. what we have been tracking for the last six days until now. >> this unprecedented day. >> an historic journey for the former president. >> placed under arrest by the government he once led. >> 37 counts related to the alleged mishandling of the classified documents. the former president called

this, quote, one of the saddest days in the history of our country. >> you can sense the anticipation. >> the circus like atmosphere. >> both donald trump and walt nauta have been booked inside that federal courthouse. >> this is someone who's charged with federal crimes which could send him to prison. this is not a day of celebration. >> he has pled not guilty. >> mr. trump sat stone-faced. >> arms tightly folded across his chest. >> the historic federal indictment of a former president of the united states. >> this is one of those times where you think about where you get your information, your news, your facts, who are you living it with together. we showed you that side by side of something that is not normal. donald trump, now booked and arraigned in two separate jurisdictions in the span of just over two months. not normal, not a good thing for him. is it good for the country? can we handle it? we did it in new york.

days after, that everyone moved on. here tonight we live through this. we turn to our colleague and someone who has brought you so many big news stories after so many years here at msnbc, lawrence o'donnell, host of "the last word with lawrence o'donnell." >> i haven't been here in years and i'm taking one of these. the question of, where were you when this happened? i get it. but i have a strong feeling a month from now, a year from now, people's answer is going to be i don't know. i don't remember. it should be a really gigantic, momentous, historic feeling that people are having, but the notion that donald trump could break laws, i think was built into more than half of the voting population before he was elected president. right? and the trump side of it, you

can see, is pretty unmoved by it. you know, when he announced his first indictment, which he was off by a week when he predicted what would happen in manhattan, he summoned people to manhattan. he sent out the january 6th summons. everybody come. you know, and they didn't. they didn't. and they saw that they didn't. i came. i walked down there that morning and found this very peaceful crowd. little -- chanting but very, very peaceful. i walked among all the trump supporters who were there. none of themme. same thing today in florida. now, florida, you know, has even more available trump voters to that spot. although, let's remember, manhattan had 68,000 trump voters. about 50 of them, 75 of them showed up in manhattan. so what you're seeing is on both

sides there's a kind of built in -- it's not momentous. even the people who are out there protesting, you know, donald trump being arrested again today, it's such a small group. their energy is so low that they were kind of ready for it. you know what i mean? they're not shocked. >> when you say that, it's interesting. we had an analyst on here who's in radio, and he said he's so tired of hearing politicians say, this is not who we are when it comes to problems. this is who we are. you're reminding us for donald trump it's more of a feature than a bug, lying to feds, covering things up, it is who he is. >> yeah, but it's worth pausing over us imagining, say, 2015, 2014, before there's a whiff of donald trump. in 2014, a fairly short time ago, if you said, there's going

to be a headline with espionage, charges, and former president of the united states. you would say then, well, that's going to be the biggest thing in american history. and by the time you get to it, because of all of this behavior in the meantime, right, and the public firing of comey, all those things starting really early on, there's just no surprise level to it, though. >> are you suggesting that our personalities are now the boiled frog? weekend of just happened slowly. >> daniel patrick moynihan coined the phrase defining deviancy down, and this is a perfect example of that, where over time we lower our bar for what we think deviance is. it used to be -- so, something like this -- by the way, it is highly deviant for a former president to be charged with crimes. couldn't be more deviant.

it's never happened before. but he, donald trump, has defined deviancy down so much among us that we certainly are not shocked by it. and so it represents a challenge, right? it represents a challenge for us in the way we present it, and it represents a challenge to the country. because of this period of having defining deviancy down being a central principle of donald trump's behavior, how do we hold on to the importance of what this is? there are going to be people who don't follow much of this, to stumble across this tv and go, there they go again. they're doing that again. as if this is an extension of something else we've done before when, no, it isn't. this is brand new. there's a communicative challenge that we all have about the seriousness of this, about the historic significance of it, and it's not a challenge easy to meet because of the way it all

unfolds. >> that go to something i wanted to show you for your reaction, because the danger is not defined by people like me and you who are just observers, and it's not define by donald trump's critics. the danger, which is why we have these laws, was defined by the team in the national security community to create and erect and maintain these intelligence standards. and there can be overclassification, there can be debates, but in the main the idea is we have to protect things so people don't get killed unnecessarily. and some of the people who say that and do that are some of the people who actually risk their darn lives. that's the source. it's not the critics. then the source of how important it is to sound like you agree with that comes from donald trump himself. i'm going to show you something we made. partly it's from donald trump. his words. partly from jack smith. the parts that are evidence in this case, donald trump's words

as evidence, are stamped and part of it -- this is why he has a problem in court, because he said or claimed or pretended to care about the laws he's now accused of breaking. >> hillary's likely to be under investigation for many years. i'm going to enforce all laws concerning the protection of classified information. we also need the best protection of classified information. we could very well have a sitting president under felony indictment and ultimately a criminal trial. >> so, the striking thing is, he's reading every one of those statements off a teleprompter. you'll notice that they're actually clear english, those are not trump sentences that are just a blather of words. so he's reading off a teleprompter, and as you know, jack smith used them in the indictment. he used those words to indicate

that donald trump knows what the law is. this is not an ignorance of the law case. he can't pretend he thought it was okay. that's why he has those words in there. and so it's using donald trump against donald trump which, prosecutors apparently are finding pretty easy to do. >> exactly, and it's that language that could be presented if they get to a jury when he says, i didn't know, as you say -- >> here's the thing, right, you have to assume that he can not testify. >> no, i don't think he can. >> his former lawyer who you interviewed, i interviewed after you, he said to me on air that he didn't think donald trump could possibly testify. so let's just assume that's true. that you cannot put donald trump on the witness stand in this case. well, then, how do you do it? you can't get in -- what testimony could you get in -- what evidence could you get in that donald trump thought it was okay? the only way to get that in is he has to get on the witness stand and say, i thought it was okay. so that's not really going to be

available as a defense, you know, without putting him on the stand, which you just can't do. >> to your point, we've seen a preview from the speaking indictment. jack smith plans call lawyers and aides up and say, you told him he couldn't do it? you told him it was a crime? i think i know where to find you tonight. >> we're all working overtime. i believe you have been on 24 hours. >> not 24 straight. >> every time i go to tv, ari melber's there. >> i appreciate that. >> we need you. >> on that wall. lawrence o'donnell is part of msnbc's special coverage tonight which begins at 8:00 p.m. eastern tonight. you see the team there. keep it locked, because the last word will be one not to miss, 10:00 p.m. eastern every night on msnbc. still ahead, why are we talking about so much prison time? we will explain. explain. wayfair has nice prices so you can have nice things. hah! kelly clarkson, we have a kid...

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our laws that protect national defense information are critical to the safety and security of the united states, and they must be enforced. we have one set of laws in this country, and they apply to everyone. >> there you have it. jack smith meant it. that was the first time he ever spoke in his current post as special counsel, in insisting these charges last week that no

one is above the law. donald trump facing charges for illegally holding secrets. one document addressed united states nuclear weaponry. others had top secret or other classifications for privileged information about foreign countries' military ops. now, all of this can carry serious prison time, and many people, before all of this -- whatever you think about all this, whatever you think of the politics of all this, it is a historic national security fact that others have been charged and at times convicted of mishandling at times smaller amount of information. take an air force colonel who was caught with 300 documents at home and sentenced for three years. or an air force veteran who took secrets, some stolen by russian hacker sentenced to three and a half years from prison amor a contractor who stole millions of

pages of documents and they were found in a scary and irresponsible set of storage locations, like storage shed, a car, and his own home. if they reminds you of the bathroom gate of all this, well, he got nine years. and those were arrests that, think about this tonight as we cover this -- you didn't have to have a deep state or trump vendetta, those arrests were taken seriously at the time and they made headlines. >> a retired u.s. air force intelligence officer admitted to keeping classified documents at his tampa home. >> admitting to removing and retaining highly classified documents. those documents were believed to be subsequently stolen from his home computer by hackers. >> harris martin tracker iii. download and removed huge

amounts of information. >> those are real precedents. that is real case law. it is a reminder that these are real crimes. those people who were convicted did realtime. so, that's not the question if you end up debating this online, on reddit, or with some uncle or family member who says all this is made up and new. that's just not true, and sometimes you have to walk away from people who don't want to deal with truth. the question isn't whether this is new and made up. it's not. these are real crimes with real histories. the question is whether or not donald trump did commit these crimes and will a jury of his peers find that? that is the open question. he is legally presumed innocent. keep your eye on the ball. we'll be right back. your eye . we'll be r back. and one of three new flavoed g. ...this is not your grandpa's crabfest... ...unless grandpa's got flavor. dayumm! crabfest is here for a limited time. welcome to fun dining. ♪

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something federal defendants are usually told sooner or later in the process, and that may weigh on donald trump's mind is that federal criminal defendants, as a group, are convicted at over 99% . that includes defendants who pleaded guilty as well as those convicted at trial. if you look at criminal defendants who took it to trial, you see the conviction rate is still high at 83%. if the past is a guide here, being a federal defendant is a tough slog.

meanwhile, donald trump's former attorney general put it more simply, saying his old boss is now basically, legally toast. >> this entire thing came about because of reckless conduct of the president. battle plans for an attack on another country or defense department documents about our capabilities are in no universe donald j trumps personal documents. if even half of it is true, then he is toast. it is a very detailed indictment and very damning. >> that is the take from bill barr. there is also the take from 50 sent to referred to the fact that if you're convicted in federal court, you have to do a lot of your actual prison sentence, referring to the 85% rule. he said with the fed to do 85% of your time. that means if you do 10, you will do nine.

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