how that friendship with elo musk played out since he interview. >> well, i have done som weirdly timed interviews in my life it was a very interesting le time, some might say impeccabl timed interview. i interviewed him on the thursday and apart from th mistakes that he confessed t in corrected later, we flagged some mistakes in his reporting pretty big ones -- the big issue was -- that is on thursday. on friday, it turns out, musk' twitter is blocking access o links to substack, which mat tybee uses matt tybee tweets, i'm going t go to substack and stop goin on twitter that is on friday. on saturday, elon musk i tweeting, well, what my tybe said is false and elon musk' drops falling him. which is hilarious sequence of events it is almost trumpy. -- lots of people will thro themselves on, people go t prison for trump and he doesn' care he throws them off the bus he shows no melting return

musk, so similar people willing to sacrific their reputations for him. not to you be, as you said once the scourge o billionaires, comes on my show and says - billionaire throws him under the bus. and it is just bizarre and sat and i think, you know, let's see what happens next. definitely trouble in paradise between musk and pay be >> bizarre and sad i thin is a very appropriate word for what happened. not just in the last couple of days but in the last couple of years. mattie, great interview, alway great to see you great work enjoy the rest of your evening saw >> coming up on a mi >> coming up on him in, - the events of this last week would suggest no and how voters are reactin could signal a meaning shift a 24 and four. mike pence hands jack smith remarkable opportunity by a -- 2020 election.

what it could mean for the former president and congressman ro khanna from the house oversight committee is here, joining us live. his republican colleagues ar being accused of a intentional representation - into the biden family. we will get his insights o that and much more i am ayman mohyeldin let's get started. >> donald trump made his first appearance inside a courtroo tuesday. it was also, perhaps, the firs time the ex president foun himself responding to orders instead of actually giving them for. decades, the real estate tycoo answer to one man and one ma only himself. as washington post philipp bump put it, trump, quote wa in geopolitical terms, a autocrat as head of the trump organization, he grew used t acting with total impunity that professional history, bum argues, inform the e presidents view of democracy

and democratic elections a quote, not of an electorat empowered to choose its leaders, but instead, a process to be manipulated for power. it was his disregard for the democratic process that helped lead this nation to a crisis o january the 6th. but america's democracy proble goes much deeper than donald trump. just look at the events that unfolded in tennessee this week republicans in the state's general assembly expel two black democratic lawmakers justin jones and justin pearson, for violating the chambers rules and decorum. the act of retaliation cam after the democrats joined wit protesters in the chambers gallery, calling on lawmaker to pass new gun safety laws, following the horrific schoo shooting in nashville, which left six people dead including three children typically, such violations but result in a mirror slap on the rest, but republicans in thi state, well, they pounced on it they insisted on flexing their power. as a result, thousands o president tennesseeans are now or without representation.

here's what jones had to say ahead of his expulsion thursday >> the world is watching tennessee. the world is watching tennessee. because what is happening here today is a farce of democracy. this is a historic day for tennessee but it is, it ma mark a very dark day for tennessee, because it will signal to the nation that ther is no democracy in this space. it will signal to the nation that if it can happen here i tennessee, it is coming to you state next >> it is coming to your stat next jones's claim is not hyperbolic according to research from university of washington political science professor, jake for cramp, tennessee is the least democratic state i the entire country that is thanks to its egregiou partition air gerrymandering a the state and federal level. in research from the princeton

gerrymandering project, it shows that there is not single competitive see in th states senate, meaning tha republicans have in your guaranteed super super majorit in the upper chamber but tennessee, of course, is not alone. all you have to do is look a wisconsin. kamala referred it to as the most gerrymandered state in th country. despite that, this week it was the site of a rare wave fo democracy. on tuesday, judge janet prop t see what's scored an 11-poin victory over conservative judg dan kelly. kelley appears to be no fan of democracy and self in fact, he advised republican party officials on anything -- on the 2020 election thursday - gives their liberals - states highest court in 15 years, and with that power, th court could hand down majo rulings on important issues, abortion, voting rights and yes, even gerrymandering. as the atlantic's -- could return to wisconsi

something it's legislative election hasn't had in years democracy. >> joining me now -- justice -- sarah gillespie. madam secretary of state, than you very much for making tim for us tonight want to talk to first about th events unfolding in a differen state, that in tennessee and i want to just get you thoughts on that, broadl speaking thousands of constituents ar now without representation that does not seem to bother republican party is this how a party in power i supposed to act? what do you think of these republican lawmakers and their actions, and what they say about the state of democracy not just in tennessee, but our country as a whole >> it is horrifying. what you see in tennessee. but when you boil it all down, it is not about policies it is about this super power grab that republicans are usin and working to further continu

to strengthen, because they do not want the will of the peopl to succeed - and when you are looking a tennessee, we know a majorit of americans want common sense gun safety legislation but how do they stop that? they stopped it by pulling awa legislators who can actually have a voice in this and start working towards making a difference and we saw this same thing i wisconsin. when republicans lost contro of our executive branch in 2018, what did they do they literally had - tried to take away powers from the governor, attorney general and other statewide electe offices. this is what they do they tried to have a power grab >> you know, as i mentioned, your stay was the site of rare win for democracy thi week in all of the various places where democracy is being rolle back in america. however, you have republican lawmakers in your state alread eyeing a possible impeachmen

against judge protegee wit after they won a supermajority in the state senate. are you concerned about that do you believe an election immediately followed by threat of impeachment is a sign of healthy democracy in wisconsin >> no. and what i am hopeful about, a man, that i want to point out, is that on tuesday, wisconsi nights said enough with th attack on democracy. we saw this in a few different ways we saw a record breaking turnout with young people an women in our entire state. we also, by the way, the couldn't gerrymander a statewide supreme cour election so one voice and one vot counted. but the other thing is tha wisconsinites said no to dan kelly, who is a potentia election denier. he is the individual tha literally was involved i advising the republican part to overturn the will of th people with the fake elector in 2020. and so, wisconsin and i really believe the rest of the countr

can feel good knowing that dan kelly is not going to be abl to sit on the highest cour here in wisconsin, that can be involved in election decisions in the future. >> yes incredible how states like wisconsin are staying no to -- following through to the republican party leadership, broadly speaking wisconsin secretary of state sarah godlewski, thank you ver time i really appreciated as always >> let's continue this conversation now with christin greer, associate professor o political science at fordham university, and barbara mcquade, former - michigan law school, she's als an msnbc legal analyst christina, first, i want to ge your thoughts on what we saw i tennessee this week and what i says about american democracy. there may be some that are looking at it and thinking, oh this is just power politics in a state in tennessee but i, and i'm sure you an others, probably see this as a sign of american democracy tha is sadly, at this moment

regressing >> absolutely, amen. we have been talking about thi for years. i think there's good news an bad news i will start with the bad news first. this is -- democratic republic, we se this as a power grab we - write after reconstruction wit african american lawmakers it is a blatant disregard of the constitution, of liberty of principles. let's not forget, these thre members that were expelled they weren't expelled becaus they were -- they are fighting for gu reform and legislation after children and citizens of the state of tennessee have been murdered senselessly they are saying, enough is enough that is the bad news that republicans just refuse to recognize the danger we are in with guns in our community, but also how they will jus throw out any members that the disagree with in any fashion that is the bad news the good news is this. i have never seen young people so mobilized

i have never seen -- the attention to politic saying, this is wrong. something is amiss most people do not understan our various levels o government and not just the three branche of government, most people don't understand the differenc between local state and federa politics it has shown the light on th -- state level politics most people don't participate, we can look at our participation numbers for stat legislators once - dismal number saying and i think we are going to se a little mobilization of not just young people, but peopl who haven't registered for i and saying, actually, my vot could matter because if i don't participate men like those that we hav seen in the republican party i the state of tennessee wil continue to rain with zero control and zero - >> and barb, we talk a lot about the negative aspects about what the republican part is doing in states lik tennessee and texas an elsewhere. and it brings me back to wha is happening here in new yor with donald trump. because the message is ver

important to reinforce at time when democracy is being rolled back in some regards. that is equal treatment unde the law. it is a basic tenant of ou country's democracy and ou ideals in a way, one could argue that trump's indictment is actually good for our struggle in democracy. >> absolutely, amen. it is never get that somebod may have been committing a crime, has been accused of committing a crime, tua is a former president, who is a leader, but if in fact it ha happened, then i want to liv in a country that will hol everybody accountable, even former president and so much of the criticism that we are hearing is thi criticism that this is a political prosecution. but in fact, as alvin brag pointed out, this is a crime he is charged 30 times since taking office in 2022. manhattan is the financial capital of the world and the falsification of busines records is a crime that they routinely charge so if you think about that what trump and his supporter are really asking for is

special treatment, simpl because he is a former president. that he not be charged because of who he is but if the rule of law means anything, it means tha everybody gets treated the sam way under the law. no better and no worse and so i think that in tha regard, it is a good thing t see him charged with these crimes, so that it doe reinforce the rules in thi country. >> christina greer, barbar mcquade, please stick around we have a lot more to discus with you have to break coming up, did mike pence hand special counsel jack smith a gift why his testimony could hurt trump. but first, richard louis i here with the headlines. hey richard. >> hayman. very good evening to you u.s. officials say classifie u.s. documents are recentl appearing on social media ar likely real, but officials say some of these documents that detail ukraine's war effort ma have been altered before the were posted. the justice department and pentagon are investigating the source of this potential leak. pope francis calling for peace in ukraine during his easter sunday remarks in st. peters

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probe, donald trump is facin -- a key witness who is ver familiar with the january 6t insurrection, a judge ha ordered former vice presiden mike pence to testify in the special counsel's investigatio in the trump's attempt t overturn the 2020 election and this week pence confirme that he will not fight tha order, although it is stil unclear when exactly he will appear before the grand jury pence's testimony could give jack smith one of the most revealing firsthand accounts s far of trump's state of mind i the weeks after his loss to jo biden. but trump's attorneys coul still appeal the ruling, which is not uncommon. last month trump - for his top aides to testify my panel is back with me t discuss. barbara, i'll start with you i this round legal experts, they have sai that criminal investigations usually proceeds executive privilege, which is, something trump and his attorneys have argued for in the past so what trump's attorneys even have a case if they try to appeal the judges ruling

ordering pence to testify? now that mike pence is not going to be fighting it? >> no. i don't think so, a man. i think, as you say, it wa really settled in the united states versus nixon case bac in the watergate era tha executive privilege exists t promote candor for presidentia aides to talk with him without worrying that someone down the road is going to make them spill the beans and say what they said. but it is only a qualified privilege. and it is outweighed by things that are more important in the national interest. and criminal investigations is one of those things. so i think at best, donald trump, could cause a delay i further proceedings, but not b much, at this point. so it may be futile to further appeal this. and i think one where the other, in short order, mike pence i going to be sitting in front o a grand jury >> and christina, there is another aspect of this there's a legal one and th political calculation. pence said that he has quote nothing to hide. and i want to talk to you abou the political implications o this will trump try to smear penc

before this all goes down? or will he try to keep him o his side at this point, do you thin mike pence even cares abou protecting donald trump? because to some extent, th president, the former presiden has already thrown mike penc under the bus. he has called him all kinds of names, after and on january th 6th. i wouldn't say he has been a defender of mike pence, give what mike pence did on that da ending his presidency. >> right. so we know that mike pence has just been a feckless leader if we can even call him that. but as barbara mentioned donald trump's tactics hav always been to delay and the appeal and that road may have run out so if that is the case, we hav seen donald trump with his bac in the corner. there's absolutely no way he will try to get pence on his side or be conciliatory an appropriate in anyway. i think that he is scared. he is finally facing several crimes

let's not forget that he would be back in court at the end of the month facing - charges. so there's a lot of th presidents play. -- gracious words for the forme fresh -- -- -- on january six she has not them since the sad thing is that mike pence stands by a man wh consistently through the month and speaks about him in th most inappropriate terms of an president. i -- posts on his truth social bu even today about easter, you can see the undercurrents of him talking about someone like a pence. and so the fact that mike penc doesn't stand up to donald trump, largely because he is afraid of supporters, but mike pence doesn't have a base. so he is grappling around hi either so we are seeing jus essentially a bully continuing to bully his former vice president and his vice president taking it. this is the minor standard tha i will actually abide by the law and sit in front of possible grand jury, but it is not that president trump wil

ever reach out and all o branch in any way, shape o form it is not who he is. it is not who he has been. we can't expect new behavior from men who has no shame. >> barbara, put yourself i jack smith's possession here with the line of questioning you would want to go after mik pence with as i mentioned, generall speaking, obviously mike pence has a lot of insight into th thinking of donald trump fro election day up until januar the 6th, but specifically, i you were the special counsel what are you probing at here one of the questions that yo are asking mike pence to try and find out specifically if a law was broken >> well, i would want to ask mike pence about the conversations he had wit donald trump when they wer alone. maybe we can get things from aids about other conversations they had,, but when they wer alone. the key factor i want to b looking for is that corrupt or fraudulent intent. there is a potential crime her for conspiracy theory to defraud the united states when he was pressuring mike pence t

abuse his power and overturn the election on january 6th. but a key part of that i knowing that he truly lost the election so i would be probing fo questions about that, about hi admissions that he didn't wi and he did miked pence t overturn the outcome of th election and the other thing that i really important here, a man is walking and mike pence to a story right now, even if h doesn't offer anything that is new and a value, what is mos important is that you talk t him so that a year for hour tw years from now, when this case goes to trial, mike penc doesn't testify until some new story that nobody has ever heard before >> all right, barbara, christine up please stick around. we have much - next, congressman ro khanna is here it democrats on his committe or accusing house oversigh chair james comer of withholding information into his biden family probe six round. ♪♪ voltaren. the joy of movement.

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democrats of not being transparent with the america people, but what if i were t tell you those same republican are intentionally withholdin key information in their probe into biden that is what house oversight committee democrats ar accusing chairman james come of doing comer, during his endles right-wing media tour ha repeatedly stated he has met with four individuals he has characterized as whistleblower in relation to his probe int the biden's business dealings. ranking member jamie raski called him out in a letter saying comer's own staff confirmed that he is onl spoken with two people and n witness information wa provided comer responded, essentially admitting to hiding informatio saying, quote, multipl individuals have approached th oversight committee as whistleblowers with the desire to share information confidentially it should be no surprise tha whistleblowers do not trus ranking member raskin. the gop promised to investigat president biden and his family has been a key part of their

agenda since taking over a house majority but according to politico, the party base is chafing at the lack of big bombshells and concrete steps against administration officials t backup all of the lawmakers' top. so, it's calmer all talk and what is behind his efforts to conceal his suppose bombshell whistleblowers california congressman r khanna has had a front row sea to this chaos. he sits on the oversight committee. he joins me now. congressman, it is great to se you again. thanks for coming back on th show as i said, you have some uniqu insights here. what do you make of comer' comments essentially admitting that he is withholding information from you and you colleagues under the guise o protecting them, because the do not trust the democrats o the committee? >> first of all, the committee is not doing what the american people want us to do, which is to focus on lowering prices, focus on bringing jobs, it has been a total wild goose chas

trying to implicate that extended family who have nothing to do with governance. it is not like they have any case against this president or this presidents official action they're going after people who are not even in the government and they aren't bein transparent with who actuall is - to say that people maybe whistleblowers, i mean, that i an infinite universe the chair has said that ther were four specific people wh came before him, then he sai to we don't know. the standard procedure is -- the minority and i think thi is because they don't really have evidence. it is just trying to creat smoke and mirrors to get u down on the president. >> - protect the former president o the other hand by trying t obfuscate or obstruct, if yo will, what is happening in manhattan. it is not just the oversight committee that is politicizing these investigations as i mentioned, you have got jim jordan, who was the hous

judiciary chairman, he is no trying to get involved with th manhattan da alvin bragg's probe into trump he is requesting testimony fro former new york county special assistant da mark pomerantz fo his previous rule leading th probe into trump's finances. bragg has responded accusing the house republicans of tryin to undermine his investigations your thoughts on this and ur reaction to this move by jim jordan >> i have a simple in this ide in this country, how do we let lawmakers from even makinglaws and we let prosecutors in la enforcement to the prosecution so, let the da deal with his case if there are any -- parties with some person president biden's family, le law enforcement do that. the reason we got elected us t deal with health care and to deal with jobs, to do with prescription drugs reproductive rights. we should be focused on that instead, what you have i people on the republican

oversight committee who really want to be prosecutors i don't understand why they ra for congresses they want to be prosecutors. >> what do you make of the way that republicans are sayin that, you know, that everythin is being weaponized, they ar constantly complaining about the government weaponizing the doj for, example, and yet here they are trying to undermine a credible law enforcement investigation with alvin bragg and the case that is being brought against the president? >> it is a horrible look for them i think people see it. they all want any member o congress, democrats were republicans, to be bullying, intimidating the distric attorney i mean take this out of th case against president trump think about the precedent it sets if a member of congress can go to a district attorne and start undermining thei ability to enforce the law we would not be a nation of th rule of law. if people think that the cas

doesn't have merit against the president, they can speak down on that in the first amendment they can organize peaceful rallies. they can take a lot of judicia action and i have confidence in our judicial system. the cases can go all the way u to the supreme court which, by the way, is stacke with conservatives so, what is shocking to me it's not shocking but just s disconcerting is that they'd feel the need to go outside th channel of our judicial proces and interfere. that is not a good look fo them >> let me, if i can, congressman, switch gears to another important story that i developing there has been a lot o discussion recently gave classified documents detailing american and nato plans fo building up the ukraine and in military ahead of a plan offensive against russia troops tell me a little bit about how congress is responding to this development. >> i sit on the chin committee. -- to beat is very simple

we stand up against putin' illegal invasion against ukraine. first and foremost, because th citizens and lives in ukraine. but second, as a single, signa to the world that you can't be an authoritarian regime an march into another sovereign nation and not expect the worl to react that we are very proud of ho president biden and lincol mobilize nato to do this i will continue to support the aid to ukraine to stand up for ukraine. and i expect the vast majority of the congress and democratic republic to do that. >> let me, before i go, ask of us something that you and have it discussed in the past. that is about specifically but a trip that you will be making next week. you will be going to pennsylvania south carolina, i believe. to celebrate, turquoise. it is a program you and i have talked about - help empower students from low income communities to actually become world entry level software engine ears, to try t balance the playing field, s

to speak, because it is quit uneven at this moment in our development. tell me a little bit about that >> well, i'm proud of the role i play in helping brin benedict college and hbc together with tech wise, a well as allocating community college to the - here is what the program does. 20 young folks everywhere get 5000 dollar stipend, 18 lump - they get a 16 -- dollar drop at the end of it and it is successful doesn't require a full fou year degree. we need to be doing this for hundreds of thousands of students, prepare them for man of the jobs of the 21st century, whether that is in manufacturing or retai technologies, it is a ke component. there's no reason we can't d this >> congressman ro khanna always a pleasure, sir thank you for making time fo us >> thank you it's an honor. thanks for having me >> coming up, voters i wisconsin generally like the idea of a maga-backed extremis sitting on their states highes court. what this signals fo

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to hard-working muscles and joints, for all-day energy. >> - liberal candidate janet priebu say what's won her race, marking the first time in 15 years that the court will have a democratic majority. conservative candidate danie kelly, back in 2021 advised th states republican party on its fake electorate scheme, gave what we can only describe as a sore loser concession speech watch. >> i do not have a worth opponent to which i ca concede. this was the most deeply deceitful, dishonourable despicable campaign i have eve seen - for the courts it was truly beneath contempt.

my opponent is a serial liar this is the future that we hav to look forward to in wisconsin >> wow keeping it classy there and ge this - wait for it impeaching pro t say what's who, by the way won by more than ten percentag points it. wasn't even close. so, do republicans just not ge it do they not understand how democracy works? the voters made their wishes clear. as - new washington post, the warning to republicans could not be more blunt. if you keep pushing right-wing judges widely out of step with the 24 century united states t trample on cherished civil rights, voters will boot you out up and down the ballot let's bring in my next guest - chair. he joins me now. it's great have you with us. thanks very much for makin time for us.

-- it is so outrageous. if you want to get your take o what has happened. what do you make of thes premature impeachment threat that have been leveled against janet. is this all republicans have t offer for now? >> - it is pure bluster it is in keeping with th republican strategy of seeking power at all costs whether o not voters want them to have i in the reality is that i wisconsin if there is an impeachment and a vacancy gets filled by no point made by the governor which saw - its oh they are just throwin this around to fire up their base and they already starte retreating from it ever sinc the numbers came in so clearly with a landslide for janet protasiewicz republicans are kind of out of options at this point. they have flirted with the ide of trying to make a tiny, tiny gesture towards moderating o their total abortion ban and then immediately the decided no, they couldn' possibly do that

and frankly, they have reape the whirlwind. the idea that you can rid th state in gerrymander the masse to give yourself a supermajority in the state senate and near supermajorit in the - rip away a basic human right t bodily autonomy, of freedo people of catch don for half a century and then not face an consequences, well, the whol idea just collapsed in a bal of flames on tuesday night i wisconsin. and i think we will see things like that happen across th country as we go into 2024 >> i don't want this to soun like a simplistic question budgets tuesday's results show that - maga activists and - simply doesn't resonate with voters on one hand, republicans are looking at the same results as you and me republicans must at some point say, hey guys, this is not working. these maga guys, these mag candidates, the quality of these candidates is simply not resonating we must change course. but yet they keep nominating these extremists and electio deniers in more races than ove

the past two years >> republicans have come created a trap and then steppe directly into it now they're like is caught i the bear trap that they set. they essentially have built up this far right maga base and told that base that -- stealing elections they need t stomp on voting rights, that democrats were evil and they needed to destroy the freedo to control your own body and decide whether to access a saf and legal abortion now a huge part of the far-right base in the gop, boost by fox news channel an right-wing talk radio, defense a no compromise take n prisoners power at all costs approach what that means is that th people who are trying to say no, this is an electoral jet and i a general election, they los in primaries we are about to see this exact situation take place in th republican primary for president. we saw the same thing in senat races across the country, an governor races across th country. that is why no republicans abl to defeat an incumbent

democratic senator in 2022 even though the historical physics suggests that the wind should have been behind th republican sales, not th democrats. so the ride has been capture by the very very far right especially the political entertainment industrial complex. i don't see a path out of that for them other than losing a lot of elections to the poin where they decide they need to do something dramaticall different. >> it is not hyperbolic to say that this was a high stake election, especially wit someone like kelly, wh reportedly advised republicans on legal efforts to overturn the 2020 election. i want to actually play this sound of charlie carcass conservative radio host, reacting to this week' results. watch. >> there goes the wisconsi supreme court. and it decreases our chance to be able to win the white house in 2024. >> what do you make of that? is he saying the quiet part ou loud >> frankly, it is the loud part. a bunch of these people, alexander, who is a --

insurrectionist, says he doesn't see a path to -- electoral college vote anymore. their whole plan was to try to get people in place that could overturn another electoral los in 2024. that was a nationwide strategy suppress the vote and if the couldn't suppress the vote enough to win steal th election overturn the results. wisconsin is the crown jewel the state that they need to get. pennsylvania in michigan are looking pretty brutal righ now. so wisconsin which i permanently on a knife's edg with the only state -- come down to less than one percentage point wisconsin was a state where they thought the could grab it. -- and. wisconsin, the first presidential primary a debat is in wisconsin and even the next republican a national committee meeting is i wisconsin because they thought they needed wisconsin and they could get it but they lost the supreme court race now they will have to win fair fight i think they know that they ar not up to the task >> it's incredible when you pu in that context of how muc republicans are banking on

winning response and yet her they are being dealt thi setback. -- greatly appreciate your time i your insights. always a pleasure. next, how the string o democratic wins this wee exposes massive liabilities fo the gop heading to the 2024. some of what we are just discussing there with ben. stay with us ♪ ♪ ♪♪ voltaren. the joy of movement. ♪♪ okay everyone, our mission is complete balanced nutrition. together we provide nutrients to support immune, muscle, bone, and heart health. yaaay! woo hoo! ensure with 25 vitamins and minerals and ensure complete

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trouble the gop maybe come 2024 it is also making clear what issues could energiz democratic voters and what i at stake we just finished talking about janet protasiewicz, who's when flip the wisconsin supreme court to the left. she's been vocal bette pro-choice values and erwi will likely lead to a reversal of the states and take a quick dated abortion ban also this week, a huge win for progresses in chicago. democrat brendan johnson be hi moderate contender paul vallas in that mayoral race -- former educator and organize with the chicago teachers unio campaigned on issues such as affordable housing and reproductive rights. now, the alarm bells are ringing loud and clear the gop's liabilities have bee exposed according to politico, and the wall street journa called this week a five alar warning for republicans. now how, is this for timing? a trump appointed judge in texas has suspended the fda' longtime approval for the ke abortion pill mifepristone -

to appeal his decision but i the ruling goes into effect it would curtail access nationwide in only matching republicans are looking at this ruling - week after week -- christina, let's go big pictur here despite all the gop's rhetoric around abortion and crime, w saw this week that voter understand these issues in a much more personal and deepe way. democratic party officials hav reportedly already begun sketching a 2024 plank campaig playbook that leans heavil into these issues. how much trouble is the gop in here and how much do democrats keep this momentum going >> you know, amen, democrats just need to double down on th issues - americans. we see two out of thre americans -- woman's right to choose. they believe in marriage equity these are issues tha republicans have allowed to be

hijacked by the most radical o their party and donald trump wing of the party. now, we have to remember rebecca treacy had a brilliant piece in new york magazine tha lays this all out. americans to care about woman's right to choose. we keep using the incorrec terms of pro-life. the republican party is no pro-life they don't believe i supporting children an families they clearly don't care abou -- issues that are destroying communities and families they don't believe in helpin families once they actuall have a child you don't believe in having social - pro-life and that is not the conversation we should b having, it is a conversation about what the women have th right to autonomy of her own body so it is either pro-choice o antichoice so we need to be explicit at the length we are using. we are seeing more and mor democrats using that prope language to make sure voters know that this is issues about cannon woman, a grown woman, make her own decision about an intervention - double down on this issue that clearly are resonating not jus with democratic voters

independent voters, leanin republicans and also som moderate republicans, not just democrats who are having sex and it is not just democrats who need abortions, whether fo medical reasons or others, for a host of reasons. so if they stay the course let's be clear, if it weren' for new york, democrats woul still have control of progress -- for the democrats, and wil wear of that we can talk about that and o another show those four seats were in m state. and so we clearly know tha democrats are on the right path they just need to keep doublin down on gun control, and a woman's right to choose, o marriage equity, on issues tha really actually bring us together, and help support the democratic - >> how do you see the next few days playing about legally ove this medication abortion relaying for texas we will see more legal challenges and how, consequential could this case be and that it sends a president for other lawsuits against fda approved drugs >> all of the above.

i think, ayman, first, the justice department has already filed an appeal in the texas lawsuit with the fifth circuit court of appeals we also have that case out o washington that is hanging around, they had a different outcome than in texas. so together, i think the create a little bit of chaos about what the current statu is of the availability o mifepristone even the judge and test cyst and state is ruling for seve days to give the parties the opportunity to file that appeal i imagine that as that appea is pending in the fifth circui court of appeals, the drug wil rule maine a bailable in meantime typically the status quo i preserved. if that is - conservative, circuit court of appeals, if they affirm it i imagine this case will go to the supreme court. the issue you raised is a very significant one. the legality of this medical abortion drug loan is a very significant issue, but if it judge can overrule the decisio

of the fda, the agency that is given a for approving drugs in this, country then that ca give - drugmakers drug makers rely on an fda approval when they invest in their research and development and distribution and sales and all kinds of things with drugs the idea that a judge can come in and second guess that, think, is just untenable even if judges who are looking at this on appeal don't like the medication abortio decision, i think it will be very difficult for them to say any judge can just overturn th decision of the fda becaus they just don't like the drug. so i think, i am cautiousl optimistic that on appeal, w will see a change in thi ruling >> and use each, some extent christina, the republicans broadly speaking, they are not embracing this decision. not a lot of people have com out in support of it republican officials, i' talking about, in congress because they know abortion has not has now become a energizin

factor, a motivating factor fo democrats. and it seems like they are now running away from this issue >> right we now see republicans saying, well, let's just, women don' really care about that let's talk about other things. we have the economy and othe issues a woman's right to choos actually is an economic issue. if you're going to force a woman to come to terms for a child -- 18 plus years. so we can always work it into financial issue. i think we are definitel seeing republicans wanting t talk about anything other than abortion obviously gun control is another issue that they ar going to try to run away from. it is really important tha democrats just stay the course and make sure voters know that this is a party that is trying to take away basic rights. we have got many many decade -- the republican party wants t rollback so many issues -- the last few decades >> i was going to say, as been

winkler said earlier, th republicans set the better tra and they stepped into anothe stuck in it. christina, barbara, always a pleasure thank you so much for joinin us throughout this hour. and thank you for making tim for us make sure to catch a man bac here on msnbc saturdays at eight, sundays at nine follow us on twitter and tikto and instagram all, at a mi msnbc. until we meet again, i'm i mohyeldin in new york. have a good night. and last for weeks. it can make your workday feel impossible. the virus that causes shingles is likely already inside of you. 50 years or older? ask your doctor about shingles. (vo) businesses nationwide are switching to verizon business internet. (woman) it's a perfect fit for my small business. (vo) verizon has business internet solutions nationwide. (man) for our not-so-small business too. (vo) get internet that keeps your business ready for anything. from verizon.

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