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>> announcer: "this week" with george stephanopoulos starts right now. >> martha: deepening divide. the gaza conflict fuels protests and political divisions at home. >> what will the united states do? what will president biden do? >> martha: this morning, senator chris van hollen weighs in on the administration's actions on israel while gazans face an imminent threat of famine. >> we have a realtime humanitarian catastrophe. >> martha: this as the white house authorizes a transfer of billions more dollars of bombs and war planes to israel. britt clennett reports for the region. plus, the maryland senator weighs in on the baltimore bridge collapse. when will the port be cleared? warning signs. >> isis remains a potentially potent force. >> martha: after deadly terrorist attacks in russia and iran, how much of a threat is a resurgent isis?

>> al qaeda and isis have the opportunity to together strengthen in ungoverned spaces with clear desire to zack our homeland. >> reporter: general frank mckenzie who oversaw forces in the middle east joins us. and -- >> what after all, is a democrat like me doing at a republican convention like this? >> martha: we remember political maverick, joe lieberman with our powerhouse round table. >> martha: good morning, and welcome to "this week." this morning, some of the most powerful cranes in the country are working to clear the wreckage from the francis scott key bridge from the port of baltimore. here's a look this morning at the efforts to remove the debris from the massive cargo ship that caused the bridge's collapse and the death of the six construction workers. maryland senator chris van hollen will join us to discuss

the cleanup efforts and the long road to recovery ahead, but senator van hollen, a member of the foreign relations committee, is also making news for his direct, biting criticism of the biden administration over its handling of gaza, a conflict that is creating a humanitarian crisis and a diplomatic and political storm which is dividing the democratic party. the challenge president biden is facing was on full display this week during a star-studded new york city fund-raiser featuring three democratic presidents, but also a healthy contingent of protesters outside speaking out against the administration's response to the war. and despite diplomatic talks pushing israel not to expand push into rafah, the biden administration has moved in recent weeks to fulfill languagestanding agreements to ship fighter jets and bombs to

israel. abc's britt clennett joins us in jerusalem to start us off. >> reporter: a show of u.s. support for israel despy boiling tensions over its planned military offensive in southern gaza. the biden administration signing off on billion dollars worth of weapons after a longstanding agreement. they include 2,000-pound bombs. cracks in the u.s./israeli relationship have been showing recently. the u.s. refusing to veto a u.n. security council resolution calling for an immediate ceasefire. prime minister benjamin netanyahu responding by calling off a visit to d.c. to discuss the invasion of rafah as israel says they are disabling hamas' capabilities and rescuing hostages. the meeting now being rescheduled. this as the humanitarian crisis grows worse by the day. aid groups sounding the alarm. the u.n. warns famine is imminent and says it is israel's responsibility to allow more aid

in. james elder is speaking from gaza. >> you can open things up in the north and you can indeed the fly gaza strip. >> reporter: as a ship sets sail saturday for gaza carrying 400 tons of food, children forced onto the streets of rafah, selling whatever they can. janine offering up used pots and pans telling us, our future is gone. we used to learn in school. now there is no school. nina shows me the tent she lives in with her family at a makeshift camp after evacuating from the north. >> this is where we cook. we are suffering in getting the food. now they are celebrating what we have. >> to celebrate having basic necessities like food and water. >> reporter: her family, among the 1.3 million displaced people who have evacuated from northern and central gaza to seek safety in the southern most city only to be told they may have to leave again any day now.

>> you don't know when you are going to be attacked. our neighbors has been killed. they were sleeping peacefully, and they were killed. so each night, we think we might be the next. >> reporter: and in east jerusalem, israeli authorities threatening to deport some terminally ill patients back to gaza whenatmeir ends. those deportations stopped by israel's high court for now. 12-year-old aimmira has a brain timer. i don't want to go back, she tells me about the prospect of going back to gaza. my house is gone. my grandfather's house is gone op everything the gone. all of our dreams are gone, she says. >> reporter: and martha, with those weapons on the way, hopes are being raised once again for an end all pause to the fighting and the delegation will leave for cairo to restart talks on a hostage deal and possible ceasefire. martha? >> martha: britt clennett in jerusalem, thank you. and i'm joined now by senator chris van hollen of

maryland. good morning, senator. good to see you. let's talk about those weapons. you have been outspoken about the u.s. continuing to supply weapons, but these were approved a long time ago. so what could the biden administration have done? >> well, it's good to be with you. we need a little more hope in the world this easter, including a ceasefire and return of the hostages. look. the biden administration had been planning to submit to congress a new round of weapons proposals. they decided not to do that because clearly they knew they would encounter resistance, and so they've essentially done a run with this earlier version. so my view, martha, is until the netanyahu government allows more assistance into gaza to help people who are literally starving to death, we should not be sending more bombs. >> martha: do you think they should have tried to stop this, just not sent more weapons? >> i think the biden administration needs to enforce

the president's request. he's made two very simple requests. one, allow more humanitarian assistance into gaza. the president said, no excuses. he's also said it's a red line for him to have an invasion of rafah. so it's my view that as part of a partnership, we should get those assurances from the netanyahu government up front rather than just send weapons now and ask questions later. >> martha: but how do you do that? you've listened to prime minister netanyahu. you know he stands firm. you know he says again and again, we can't defeat hamas unless -- unless we keep going the way we've been going. so how do you push him further? short of stopping weapons. >> well, i think we need to better use our leverage. we have different parts of leverage, and one of them is sending more offensive weapons. so president biden needs to be as serious about ensuring more

humanitarian assistance gets into gaza as netanyahu has been in making his demands. i mean, we have the situation where the netanyahu government continues to rebuff the president of the united states time and time again, ignores reasonable requests, and what do we do? we say we're going to send more bombs. my view is that a partnership needs to be a two-way street, not a one-way blank check with american taxpayer dollars. this is not about saying we're not going to provide any more weapons. it's about saying, hey. we have requests. don't let people starve to death. >> martha: so you believe that israel is currently blocking aid into gaza. do you consider that a war crime? >> there's no doubt that blocking aid into gaza is a violation of international humanitarian law. with respect to certain individuals in the netanyahu government, people like finance

ministers, and others who have not only said they want to block aid into gaza, but have taken steps to block aid into gaza, that is a crime. >> martha: netanyahu is the prime minister. is he a war criminal? >> well, we're if i can going t make a decision as to what the intent of the full israeli government is. these are members of the government, the finance minister, and the person who's in charge of the police, but ultimately, that will have to be decided down the road, but in the meantime, let's just get more assistance to starving people in gaza, you know, one-third of the shipments of a humanitarian assistance into gaza have been blocked in the last month. you could open their crossing in the north and get more assistance in right now. i mean, kids have starved to death. i'm just saying to president biden, you said no excuses when it comes to getting humanitarian aid into gaza. prime minister netanyahu continues to drag his feet.

so instead of just sending bombs without in turn getting the request that you want, mr. president, let's at least make this a partnership. >> martha: do you believe there is, again, another way for israel to fight this war? to have fewer civilian casualties and still defeat hamas? that is a central question, too, and that is where that pushback comes from your republican colleagues, from others. look. we can't win this war unless we continue doing it the way it is. >> well, i strongly disagree, and president biden has disagreed. i mean, president biden is the one who mentioned the fact that there's been indiscriminate bombing. president biden has rightly said, you can't use humanitarian assistance as a bargaining chip. in other words, israel is totally within its rights. in fact, i would say it has a

duty to defend itself after the horrific hamas attacks of october 7th, but tight d not extend to restricting unnecessarily, assistance to people in gaza. so yes, you could conduct this with fewer civilian casualties, and certainly you could prevent the horror of this humanitarian catastrophe that we're watching unfold. >> martha: as you know, politically this has been very damaging to president biden. you saw the protesters, i'm sure, at the fund-raiser the other night. so what does president biden have to do to win those voters back? you're a democrat. i assume you want president biden to win. so what is your advice to him, to win those voters? >> i certainly want president biden to win. the future of our democracy depends on it and the future democracies of countries around the world depend on it. this is a case where just doing

the right thing will also result in a better electoral outcome. in other words, yes. support israel's right to defend itself. i'm all in on that. i have been that way -- i have been all in from the beginning, but reasonable requests like preventing people from starving and 2 million palestinians who have nothing to do with hamas, and the president needs to back up his no excuses language with real action and just providing a blank check, providing more bombs without getting assurances now about rafah and not making the humanitarian disaster even worse, and doing simple things right now to help people who are starving to death in gaza, those seem to be simple requests. we have a situation where netanyahu continues to essentially, you know, give the finger to the president of the united states, and we're sending more bombs. that doesn't make sense. >> martha: and senator, i want

to quickly, if you can, talk about the bridge in baltimore in your state. where you are, what's the current situation? >> so number one, martha, we're working to help the families of the six individuals we lost. >> martha: all of them? >> all of them. all immigrants. it's a clear example of their contributions and sacrifices. >> martha: honduras, el salvador and mexico. >> that's right, and the priority is to open up the channel because this is a thriving port of baltimore. we have over 15,000 people working directly for the port. thousands of others, their livelihood depends on the port, so that is the priority, and i want to thank president biden because he has followed through on his commitment. the army corps of engineer will cover all the costs clearing the channel. we have submitted our requests for rebuilding the bridge to the emergency relief program. we have invited in that program. the federal government will pay

90% of the cost and we plan to introduce legislation to cover the other 10%. >> martha: thank you. we appreciate it. happy easter. >> thank you. >> martha: up next, isis responsibility for the massacre in russia that left over 140 dead, but how has the group reemerged after we were told they were largely defeated? we'll have that conversation when we come back. but starting it eight months pregnant... that's a different story. i couldn't slow down. we were starting a business from the ground up. people were showing up left and right. and so did our business needs the chase ink card made it easy. when you go for something big like this, your kids see that. and they believe they can do the same. earn unlimited 1.5% cash back on every purchase with the chase ink business unlimited card. make more of what's yours. ma, ma, ma— ( clears throat ) for fast sore throat relief, try vicks vapocool drops. with two times more menthol per drop, and powerful vicks vapors to vaporize sore throat pain.

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♪ it's grammy getting checked on in her favorite chair. ♪ ♪ or dolling herself up to go ♪ ♪ handle all of her care. ♪ ♪ with doctors to nurses ♪ ♪ and all the people in between ♪ ♪ healthier happens in more ways ♪ ♪ than ray's ever seen. ♪ ♪ healthier happens together. ♪ isis bears the sole responsibility here, the sole responsibility, and mr. putin understands that. he shared that with their government. >> clearly this was an isis attack that took place in moscow. as it relates to isis, i think it's very important to understand that the department of defense has not taken its eye off of isis. >> martha: the white house and pentagon press secretaries making clear isis-k is to blame for the deadly attack last week at a russian concert hall. that came as a shock to many who thought isis had been all but defeated.

we'll speak with the u.s. commander of the u.s. forces in the middle east, but first a look back on the rise, fall, and reemergence of isis. >> for the next two months, our troops in iraq, tens of thousands of them, will pack up their gear and board convoys for the journey home. >> martha: it was near the end of 2011 when president barack obama pulled all american troops out of iraq after more than eight years of battling insurgents and al qaeda terrorists. i was with the american soldiers on that last convoy out, many fearing that some day they would have to return. iraq remains a very dangerous place, and there is a huge threat of sectarian violence and also al qaeda coming back in. threats that were soon realized. a new terror group emerged, an offshoot of al qaeda known as the islamic state or isis. by january, 2014, isis had made stunning gains in syria and

iraq. about five miles out of flushia, the roads were desolate and iraqi security forces warned us it was not safe to continue. by june of that year, isis had captured iraq's second large et cetera city, mosul, in a matter of days, prompting a mass of military-aged iraqi men to head into the fight. >> basically all of these young men will just be heading north to help iraqi security forces. they will be untrained, just loaded into trucks to help with the fight. >> martha: a fight they quickly lost to isis. weeks later, the terror group announcing the establishment of a caliphate governed by strict sharia law, but the united states resisted a military response. >> this is a fight the iraqi security forces have got to make it is their country. there's not going to be a military solution here. it's just not going to happen. >> martha: about a week later when the sweep of brutal isis

takeover seemed unstoppable, a change of heart. >> good evening. >> martha: president obama authorizing air strikes less than three years after the military's departure from iraq. >> i have been careful to resist calls to return time and again to our military. when american citizens are at risk, we will take action. >> martha: but isis was undeterred, publishing brutal video taped executions of civilian hostages, including american journalist james foley. at its peak, isis controlled nearly a third of both iraq and syria's territory. the group claiming responsibility for inspiring countless terrorist attacks, killing thousands globally. in 2015, striking in paris. in 2016, brussels, but by the end of obama's second term, relentless attacks from the u.s. and a global coalition had significantly degraded isis.

by 2017, less than 2% of the isis still held was still under its control. by 2019, the new president, donald trump, said isis had been wiped out. >> during my administration, i, we altogether destroyed the caliphate, 100%. >> martha: but the isis threat remained with isis-k based in afghanistan kpaexacting a devastating toll. that was clear at the kabul airport in 2021. thousands of afghans desperate to escape the taliban takeover as u.s. forces finalized a complete withdrawal after 20 years of war. an isis suicide bomber detonated in the crowd, killing 13 u.s. service members and at least 160 afghans. >> we will not forget. we will hunt you down and make you pay. >> martha: that same group

claiming responsibility for an attack this january on a memorial service in iraq that killed nearly 100 followed by this month's attack at a moscow concert hall that killed more than 140. while the u.s. did share intelligence that isis would strike a concert hall, that did not stop the terror group. and i am joined now by former centcom commander frank mckenzie, author of the upcoming book "the melting point." good morning, general. i want to start with why isis-k would go after russia. >> isis-k seeks to conduct external attacks. by that i mean attacks away from their homeland, which they regard as highly afghanistan, and they're not under a great deal of pressure in afghanistan, so when you are not under pressure at your home base, you

have the opportunity to reach out, and they hold russia accountable for actions against isis in syria several years ago. so they desire to attack not only russia, but also the united states and other nations as well. this is very much in keeping with what their stated operational design is if you will. >> martha: and the u.s. says it warned russia and iran before that, part of this duty to warn. russia didn't heed those warnings. if they had, do you think there was enough intelligence to make this preventible? >> i think we gave them pretty precise information. you know, the problem tha isis-k has and all these organizations have, is when they want to conduct an attack abroad, they have to communicate, and that communication which is often something that we have the opportunity to listen to, to gain knowledge of, and that can be reasonably precise. i think there was probably good

opportunity for the russians to have averted this attack had they listened to the material that was presented to them. >> martha: and from what you have seen and read about the suspects, these men from a war coun -- tajikistan, a war country, how does this work? >> you can be radicalized through literature on the internet. you can be shipped to attack, and there are a variety of ways this can occur. because they're tajiks, you would assume there's a connection back to isis-k. a more direct connection, but i should also note that self-radicalization -- radicalization in place if you will, by people who have access to the internet abroad, may be one of the most dangerous methods that isis can use to generate attacks and those are not going to be well coordinated. they're not going to be well planned and they won't be well supported, but they can be very

lethal because they'll be so hard to detect whereas attacks of this nature have some direction, you know, from the mothership if you will, from isis-k as you see, they are, in fact, discernible and understandable if you'll only listen to the warnings. >> martha: and general, your centcom successor michael carillo said just days before the moscow attack, they retain, quote, the capability to attack the u.s. in six months with little or no warning. what's your confidence in that intelligence? >> i think the general is spot on with that assessment. here's the problem. again, you go back to isis-k. if you can keep pressure on them in their home laland, in their base, it makes it hard for them to conduct these types of attacks. unfortunately, we no longer place that pressure on them so they're free to gain strength. they're free to plan. they're free to coordinate, and to outreach and hit us in our

homelands. so you would much rather be playing an away game than a home game. we chose to play a home game. >> martha: and you were, of course, one of the senior leaders who did not want to leave afghanistan entirely. when you look back on that period, do you think outside of the chaotic withdrawal, do you think had we left 2,500 troops there, do you think things would be different? >> i have to believe, martha, that things would be very different. we believe that -- we believed at the time that leaving 2,500 troops along with our nato partners would have left 4,000 or 5,000 troops and we would have been able to continue to work against isis which was the principle reason we were in afghanistan, to prevent attacks on the homeland. i think we might be in a very different place now. i think we might actually be safer now than we are. >> martha: we were told again and again that there's this over-the-horizon way of looking at afghanistan and tracking isis. we have, what?

2,500 troops in iraq, about 900 in syria. not enough? >> well, i think we have enough in iraq and in syria to conduct operations against isis. the remnants of isis in the euphrates river valley, and our estimate of partners there are sitting on top of the prison system with approximately 10,000 isis fighters that were incarcerated. if that prison system were to open up, we would let force on the world a whole new chapter of isis. that's very important to us. on the other hand, in afghanistan we have almost no ability to see into that country and almost no ability to strike into that country and so isis there is able to grow unabated. there is no pressure on them, and the operating theory has always been with violent extremists. you have local security forces to be able to control them and you want them to not be able to establish the connective tissue internationally that allows them

to carry out external attacks abroad, and it's very hard to do that in afghanistan where you just don't have the ability of sense. you don't have the ability to strike, and very limited resources. >> martha: so what do you think the threat to the homeland is? you heard general carillo talk about, obviously u.s. interests abroad, but the homeland, how soon -- how big is isis? >> so isis-k in particular, but isis in general has a strong desire to attack our homeland. we should believe them when they say that. they're going to try to do it, and i think the threat is growing. it has begun to grow as soon as we left afghanistan and took pressure off isis-k. i think we should expect further attempts of this nature against the united states as well as our partners and other nations abroad. i think this is inevitable. >> martha: and general, just i want to switch to israel.

the controversy about israel, do you as a general, and that was under you, israel, for a long time. do you think there is another way for the israelis to conduct this war with fewer civilian casualties and still defeat hamas? >> i think their goal of removing the military component of hamas and the political leadership of hamas that brought this war on is a task. i think it's made far more difficult by the way that hamas has cleverly embedded all of its military activities, whether it's mosques, schools, hospitals, or high-density residential areas. i think the israelis are on the genuine horns of a dilemma as they try to finish the ground campaign in gaza, and it will be a difficult stretch for them. >> martha: thank you so much for joining us this morning, general mckenzie. coming up, the biden campaign brings in a fund-raising hall with two ex-presidents. the round table takes on the 2024 race. we're back in a moment.

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at kaiser permanente, all of us work together for all that is you. at the end of the day, who do you think is actually going to look out for you? who do you think is going to fight on your behalf? who is it that really sees you and cares about you? i can't -- i'm pretty confident the other guy doesn't. this guy does. >> martha: former president barack obama making the case for a second biden term at a celebrity-filled fund-raiser in new york city this week. let's bring in the powerhouse round table. former dnc chair donna brazile, former rnc chair and trump white house chief of staff, reince priebus, npr white house correspondent asma khalid, and

abc news political director rick klein. rick, let's start with you. that was really quite the fund-raiser. $26 million, it was a report a single political event. >> they won't replicate numbers like that because you can't get that kind of star power. this was months in the making to get all three presidents on the stage at the same time, and the numbers the campaign finance has been calling significant is the biden campaign builds up a significant cash advantage over trump even though trump's planning other fund-raisers that might be just as big, but i think just as important is the messaging. barack obama and bill clinton, two presidents that were able to get working class voters on their side, the same voters that are still so much flirting or maybe potentially going over to trump entirely. there was a road map you hear from clinton and obama to make an affirmative case for biden. they come at it from different angles and directions and that's how democrats will get engaged in this election. >> martha: but there was a problem that fund-raiser,

interrupted by protesters. there was at least one inside the event, and many, many outside. >> yeah. >> martha: how does he deal with it? we ask obviously -- >> it's an ongoing question, and i think it's only become more persistent as time has gone on. we saw a gallup poll this week that shows the israeli offensive is no longer popular amongst the american public, and i think the challenge for biden as this war has gone on is it has become his war. people are frustrated over how he's handling this, with the support, and i think $26 million is nothing to laugh at. it's an astronomical amount of money to raise in a day, but it does expose the ongoing challenge the democrats have and i don't know that they have a clear answer. the convention will be in chicago this summer. chicago, cook county has the largest palestinian population in this country. chicago has a sizable population. there are permits for protest. i don't know if this is a problem they can escape from. >> martha: donna, how do they do

that? you heard, again, senator van hollen talk about that a little bit, but people like senator van hollen so publicly criticizing joe biden for that. >> look. we understand the middle east and the quagmire that exists with hamas attacking israel and the war that continues. i think the president's been very clear about his position, free the hostages. bring in more humanitarian relief for the palestinian people. we know that this war must come to an end. at the same time, i think democrats are going to prepare for a robust convention. what you -- i love his old song. you ain't seen nothing yet because if you think the democrats are only going to val galvanize only two former presidents and not galvanize the entire congress and make sure we can get out our vote, that $27 million will be giving because you have to compete on the ground

and there are some voters who will be upset with us, but many more will come to our aid. >> martha: there's money, and that's so important to a campaign, but this is a campaign like no other. y the money, does that matter as much in a campaign like this where donald trump is getting these campaign donations? >> he's hawking bibles and he had tennis shoes, and they didn't sell. yes, it matters because at the end of the day, because the former chair knows, and i'm a former chairwoman. this money will allow you to open up campaign offices and they can do door-knock and get people out to vote. >> martha: and donald trump is going to hold another fund-raiser, and what a surprise. he probably wants to break did record. >> i think he will break the record. i spent some time at the rnc over the last couple of weeks. they're expecting a massive haul at this event in april. probably will eclipse what joe

biden did, but it also illustrates how the democrat party's changed over the years, and when it used to be publicly financed, presidential campaigns. now you have the democrats and joe biden raising $20 million plus from billionaires while trying to appeal to the middle class to tell them that we're going to protect you from the rich people that we're running around new york city with. so the democrat party's changed, and they have to contend with that, and then you've got the split screen where you've got donald trump going to the funeral for the police officer who had fallen, been murdered, and then you have joe biden at the fund-raiser. look. money matters. when you need to hire 5,000 paid people to go door to door in michigan, wisconsin, and pennsylvania full-time, all the time, data, research, turnout, it's extremely expensive. >> martha: and one thing, reince, he hasn't really still reached out to others. >> sure.

most of rem this democrats that volted in that primary, but if you look at the polling, that doesn't seem to have affected donald trump so far. polling remains steady for president trump. >> martha: and we've heard from trump's daughter-in-law, recently elected as the republican national co-chairwoman who says the party does not plan to pay donald trump's legal bills. really? >> well, that's their statement. there was an effort at the rnc to make that official policy to prevent that, and that didn't have to come up for a vote at the rnc, and it is interesting. reince talked about that big fund-raiser that they're having down in florida. if you max out to that, then some of the money, about $5,000 per, i think, goes to a pac that has been paying upwards of $50 million, plus donald trump's lisle bills. there's in-arounds, whether the

rnc pays orb not. they're paying his legal bills and the rnc that reince once led is very much the trump rnc. in ousting ronna mcdaniel and putting in leadership that includes his daughter-in-law, their singular mission is electing donald trump. that's a lot different than the rnc that reince led. >> martha: i was surprised by the message from lara trump saying that the 2020 election is in the past. apparently donald trump has not gotten that message. >> no, he certainly hasn't. he certainly hasn't. you look at the imagery he posted himself on social media this past week. i think one of the most enduring legacies we've seen from trump is this sort of normalization of violent imagery, violent rhetoric. no, i don't think the former president at all is in the past, but one thing that barely caught people's attention this week that i thought was fascinating is donald trump's company publicly went on the nasdaq stock exchange. he instance tan yously made himself a multibillionaire. he needs the money, and it's

fascinating to me this isn't really garnering that much attention, that his company, which really doesn't have that much teeth behind it, is trading, you know, higher than reddit which has active user base. where and how does he use this money? it'll be fascinating to keep an eye on that. >> martha: and donna brought this up and i want to give you a chance to response. you're both abc contributors. she brought up ronna mcdaniel who was let go by nbc news. i should say one thing, reince. you have never denied the legitimacy of the biden presidency. so your reaction? >> first of all, my take on it is that a candidate has every right to bring challenges, cases, you know, things that they didn't think went well in the election, recounts if close enough under state law. once the cases are over, once you go through that

it's done, whether you like the outcome or not. the case on ronna that i find to be obvious for someone like me who's a contributor here -- i have been at other places. i've never been hired without the management bringing me in, meeting with people, doing interviews where i wasn't on a signed contract, finding whether or not i could get off the talking points or not. >> martha: and vetted. >> never mind that. the root of the problem is that the management never brought her in before the contract was signed so that all of this stuff could get worked out, and that was a huge failure in my opinion. >> martha: and donna, just quickly if you can, just your reaction to all of that. >> i have none. and you know why? i didn't understand the hire so i have none, but i've enjoyed every year of my life being on shows like this and cable television. good luck to her. >> martha: we tried to get a lot

of opinions and we appreciate them all the time. next up t round table reflects on the passing of senator joe lieberman and what it means for no labels in 2024. we'll be right back. the passing of sen when you need to prepare for unpredictable adventures... lieberman and what it means for no labels in 2024. we'll be right back. on the pass lieberman and what it means for no labels in 2024. we'll be right back. senator joe it means for no labels in 2024. we'll be right back. [drink slurp and splat.] (scream) seat protector to save the seats. [honk!] they're all yours! we're here! hey, i knew you were comin'... so i weatherteched the car! can we get ice cream? we can now. kid proof your vehicle with american made products at weathertech.com. an alternative to pills, voltaren is a clinically proven arthritis pain relief gel, which penetrates deep to target the source of pain with nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory medicine directly at the source. voltaren, the joy of movement.

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being a democrat, or a republican is important, but it is nowhere near as important as being an american. >> martha: former senator and vice presidential candidate joe lieberman passed away at the age of 82 this week. we're back with the round table, and donna, i want to start with you. you were the campaign manager for the gore/lieberman ticket in 2000. he came within 537 votes of being vice president. what will you remember most about him? >> first of all, my deep condolences to adasa and the family. that was my first major decision as a campaign manager. i made a lot of other decisions, but that was a major decision when the vice president looked at me and i was to his left. i thought he would go to chipper and he said, who would you recommend? i said, lieberman and he was shocked. he said, lieberman? i said, sir. i would not be sitting here had

it not been for joe lieberman and men like joe lieberman because during mhis youth, he went down to the south and because of his sacrifice and the sacrifice to so many of us, i recognize that's why i was there, is campaigning him. he was a man of deep faith and principle. he was humorous, fun to be with, and i will miss his judgment and talking to him. >> martha: he was an independent thinker as you well know, reince priebus. he went from al gore's running mate in 2000 to a champion of john mccain. there just aren't many people like him. >> no. he was a decent man, but i remember he would -- the kindness that he showed people is something that i hope, you know, what a legacy. i think we would all want to be remembered as decent, kind, moral. i think we all strive for that. i remember even when trump won. he reached out. he wanted to be helpful, always with that same demeanor that he

had, and he was who we said he was, and he was a good man. >> martha: and rick, he was on this program last summer talking about no labels, advocating for no labels, a unity ticket, voters dissatisfied with potential candidates now, joe biden and donald trump. so why was that so important to him, and now what? >> it's kind of a sad piece of a legacy that his final political project, his final endeavor seems to not have gone through. no labels doesn't have a candidate to put forward. chris christie was the latest and he really kicked the tires off. he was thinking about it and he was polling on it and he was trying to figure it out, and he couldn't identify that path. it may be that the lieberman project is a ways down the road, but i am struck though by how much vitriol lieberman faced. that project for supporting john mccain, for getting kind of kicked out of his own party back in connecticut. i remember covering that race

for ""the boston was to confident confident in his vision and ideas, and as reince described him, now this part of the legacy will move forward in its own way. >> martha: and just if you can, asma, robert kennedy jr., a third-party candidate, still making people very nervous. >> making people very nervous, chose a running mate and that elevates the significance of being a candidate who won't go away. a lot of people wondered, how long will this really stick around? it seems to be ongoing. democrats i talk to are very nervous with his sheer capital and money of how many states he'll be able to get on the ballot and we know the difference between 2016 and 2020 was third parties. >> martha: just that third party. exactly, and everybody's got eyes on that. we wish our best to the lieberman family on this easter sup sunday. coming up, a message of

faith from the archbishop of the ukrainian catholic church in the u.s. we'll be right back. jordan's sore nose let out a fiery sneeze, so dad grabbed puffs plus lotion to soothe her with ease. puffs plus lotion is gentle on sensitive skin and locks in moisture to provide soothing relief. a nose in need deserves puffs indeed. america's #1 lotion tissue.

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he was raised in the u.s., but in 1992 after receiving his doctorate from harvard, he was drawn back to his ancestral roots. >> ukraine survived totalitarianism, and it felt called to be a part of it. >> martha: and indeed he was. ordained in 1998, and living in the city of lviv, he helped build from scratch what would become the ukrainian catholic university. >> nobody took it seriously for ten years, which i found out in the end was very good because nobody got in our way. we could rethink a university. >> martha: in 2019, he was appointed by pope francis as head of the ukrainian catholic church in the u.s., moving back to america, living in philadelphia, but just three years later -- the country he so loved invaded by russia. tell me what it was like the

first time you went back in 2022 after the war had started. >> there was the great tragedy, trauma, which will be lasting, but there's the valor. there's the willingness of people to put aside superficial things and say, this is good, and this is evil. this is true, and this is false, and i'm willing to risk my life for it. >> martha: and so many of the lives lost have directly affected guziak. 28 members of the catholic university community in ukraine have been lost in the war including graduates like artem killed by mortar of one of gudziak's seminary classmates. >> i knew him, and he was a great kid, and he sacrificed his life to defend the innocent, to defend the family, the city. >> martha: what he worries about now with aid stalled is how many more will die. >> the ideology of genocide has

been articulated clearly and repeatedly. he has said, there was no ukraine, and there will be no ukraine, and where there has been russian occupation, people have been tortured and killed. we have the mass graves. you have rapes of children and grandmot grandmothers. >> martha: what would you say to those people who say, i don't really we should really send any more aid to ukraine? we've got to worry about our own country, our own >> we can no longer live in an isolated island. ukrainians are saying, let us get the job done. we need your help. we need the instruments. we need humanitarian aid. >> martha: and he has a message to those celebrating easter this weekend and all americans. >> i want to thank them for their witness and i want to relay from them, gratitude from americans, and most of congress,

the president, most specialists in this area who know the lay of the land want to support ukraine. i think the speaker of the house, senator johnson, has harped, and i am sure he will do the right thing. i want to encourage him to do it now. don't wait. >> martha: we will see what happens. when we come back, we'll mark one year held captive in russia for "wall street journal" reporter evan gershkovich.

>> martha: before we go, friday marked one year in a russian jail for "wall street journal" reporter evan gershkovich. he was in the country last march as a fully accredited journalist on a reporting trip when he was detained on espionage charges that he, his newspaper, and the u.s. government strongly deny. evan is the first american reporter to be imprisoned by moscow since the cold war just for doing his job.

"the wall street journal" publishing this powerful front page friday headlined, "his story should be here." we are hoping for evan's release as well as for american paul whelan who has been held in russia for more than five years. all of us here are keeping them, their families, and colleagues in mind this easter weekend. have a good day and a meaningful easter. bounced from one doctor to the next. does it have to be like this?

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