me, >> hello. good evening. it's me, jacob rees—mogg on state of the nation. tonight, the world health organisation's report on child alcohol use is out. and england has topped the charts. more than half of english 13 year olds have drunk alcohol. the w.h.o. year olds have drunk alcohol. the who. wants this to stop. first they came for cigarettes, but now they're coming for the booze too. we may have thought sir keir starmer labour party was merely an extension of blairism, but the socialist instinct is alive and well. as the shadow transport secretary has unveiled plans to renationalise the railways. but the question is who will pay for it? the question is who will pay for it.7 more damning evidence has emerged suggesting britain's intelligence services have been infected by wokery. a gb news investigation has revealed. spies are also told to avoid all white panels use gender neutral bathrooms and nominate each other for 13 separate diversity awards, plus , state and nation awards, plus, state and nation book club returns with tony the lord sewell, the chairman of the commission on race and ethnic

disparities , who shattered the disparities, who shattered the narratives around equality in the uk. he joins me to discuss his new book of a similar calibre, black success, the surprising truth. state of the nafion surprising truth. state of the nation starts now. i'll also be joined by my most intellectual panel this evening, gb news senior political commentator nigel nelson, and the journalist and conservative peer paul goodman. as always, i want to hear from you. it's a crucial part of the programme. email me mailmogg@gbnews.com. but now it's time for the news bulletin with tatiana sanchez. >> jacob, thank you very much. and the top story this hour. great britain has the worst rate of child alcohol abuse worldwide, and more than half of children in england , scotland children in england, scotland and wales have drunk alcohol by the age of eight. 13. that's

according to a new report. the study , by the world health study, by the world health organisation, looked at 2021 to 2022 data on 280,000 children aged 11, 13 2022 data on 280,000 children aged 11,13 and 15 2022 data on 280,000 children aged 11, 13 and 15 from 44 countries and regions. girls were found to be more likely than boys to be drinking and getting drunk aged 15. in england, wales and scotland, the world health organisation's report said alcohol, which can damage children's brains, has been normalised. it called on countries to introduce more measures to protect children . measures to protect children. tensions are high in edinburgh this evening, with the scottish greens planning to vote against first minister humza yousaf in a vote of no confidence . this it's vote of no confidence. this it's after the snps power sharing deal with the greens collapsed this morning, leaving mr yousaf in charge of a minority government. losing the vote wouldn't automatically spell the end for mr yousaf, but it would throw serious doubt over his ability to govern. the no confidence motion was proposed by scottish conservative leader douglas ross, who branded the

snp leader weak and a failed first minister. the government says more people should be using britain's trains despite widespread dissatisfaction with services. labour is promising to establish a publicly owned network led by rail industry experts, ensuring efficient and accountable services without burdening taxpayers. the government commissioned an independent review into railways independent review into railways in 2018, but little has changed since then. transport secretary mark harper says the network is still recovering from covid lockdowns . a 13 year old lockdowns. a 13 year old schoolgirl has been charged with three counts of attempted murder , after two teachers and a pupil were stabbed at a school in wales. a man valley school was put into lockdown yesterday when the student carried out the attack. the victim's injuries are not life threatening. they've been released from hospital. the attack was halted when a heroic teacher, daryl campbell , intervened, placing campbell, intervened, placing the attacker in an arm lock until emergency services arrived. the schoolgirl will appearin

arrived. the schoolgirl will appear in court tomorrow . a 15 appear in court tomorrow. a 15 year old boy has been arrested and remains in police custody on suspicion of making threats. referencing the incident and the system of grading schools with one word judgements should stay. that's according to the department of education. the government says grades such as outstanding or inadequate provide significant benefits and give parents a succinct summary of schools. the grading system came under scrutiny following the death of headteacher ruth perry, who took her own life after a report downgraded her school. her sister julie says school. her sisterjulie says the government's response is woefully inadequate. for the latest stories, sign up to gb news alerts by scanning the qr code on your screen or go to gb news. comments now it's back to . jacob. >> welcome back to state of the nafion >> welcome back to state of the nation . roger scruton once said, nation. roger scruton once said, you could say that wine is probably as old as civilisation.

i prefer to say that it is civilisation modern, and that the distinction between civilised and uncivilised countries is the distinction between the places where it is drunk and the places where it isn't. it's not often i begin a programme praising the french, but what i'm about to say our gallic cousins have the right attitude across the channel, raising children with a watered down glass of wine over dinner is still commonplace . however. is still commonplace. however. such a culture that encouraged maturation is absent sometimes in these islands. or why do i mention this .7 well, the world mention this? well, the world health organisation has issued its latest report into child alcohol use, and england has topped the charts at 44 countries examined. england came first over third of 11 year olds and more than half of 13 year olds having tried alcohol. the world health organisation, what would you expect has pushed for countries to implement more measures to interfere in family life? it is perhaps a little known fact that it is entirely legal in this country to give your children alcohol in the home if they are over the age of

five. medical professionals have been trying to have this law changed or repealed for some years, mainly citing w.h.o. studies that claim to debunk what is called the french family myth, the phenomenon to which i've already alluded this week. new ons figures confirmed concerns that the increase in alcohol linked deaths over the covid period carried on into 2022, but hidden in these figures is alcohol per capita. actually decreased in this period, which suggests that moderate and occasional drinkers drank less over the period. and it was heavy drinkers who drank more. this detail didn't deter the health fanatics from calling for a minimum price for a unit of alcohol. however this has already been tried in scotland and has not had an effect on the people. it was mainly aimed at. scotland's alcohol specific death rate is 56% higher than in england. health fanatics and pubuc england. health fanatics and public health lobby always insist on population wide measures run targeted and focused policies that help those who need it follows the very

principle of lockdown. in october 2020, the great barrington declaration was issued calling for focused protection, but the public health lobby ignored it and besmirched the scientists who had advocated it . but these had advocated it. but these scientists, in the end, turned out to be right and the real question is who decides ? parents question is who decides? parents or the state? can mothers and fathers across the land who love their children be trusted to allow a sip of champagne on new year's eve? or must the bossy hand of the state override them? being comfortable with alcohol in adulthood is a good and enjoyable thing, allowing children to grow into drinking sensibly is wise . banning things sensibly is wise. banning things leads to deceit and excess . oh, leads to deceit and excess. oh, and it has biblical sanction. after all, jesus christ our lord and saviour turned water into wine, not orange juice, soy milk, or any other beverage without alcohol. in it. as ever. let me know your thoughts mailmogg@gbnews.com i'm well, i'm very pleased to be joined now by sandra parker from the

wonderfully named just the tonic. sandra thank you for coming in. thank you. most parents are perfectly sensible about this, and may allow a little sip of wine to their children . isn't it right that children. isn't it right that they should decide, rather than they should decide, rather than the state needing to intervene? >> well, like you, i'm not a fan of the nanny state, but what i can tell you from my work in just the tonic is that when people drink younger in this country , in the uk, they're more country, in the uk, they're more likely to have a problem with alcohol. so i speak to a lot of people that talk about drinking alcohol when they were quite young, and i know that you mentioned, you know, having a sip of champagne, or sitting down with a family, having a drink. but the studies have shown that when people do that, they're also more likely to dnnk they're also more likely to drink excessively. as a teenager and when they're older. and the thing that we understand is that when people experiment at that young age , when they're, you

young age, when they're, you know, we're talking about age 11, when they're going through puberty, if they use alcohol to cope with things like social anxiety, it can quickly become a powerful learned behaviour. >> yes, but they shouldn't be able and they're not able to buy alcohol for themselves. and so if they're doing it under parental supervision now, there are always there are some parents who are careless and that applies to all sorts of situations within the home. but most parents won't be giving their children alcohol on a daily basis to deal with stress. it will be something that they have on a special occasion, and it seems to me that an overall ban is a very heavy instrument to use against. these high numbers are mainly of children who perfectly safely drink small amounts of alcohol. nobody is saying that whatever it is, a third of 13 year olds have an alcohol problem. >> understand and look , i'm not >> understand and look, i'm not saying that parents shouldn't be allowed to decide for their children, but i just think it's interesting when children are

that young, you know, we wouldn't give them cigarettes. so you know, cigarettes are different , aren't they? different, aren't they? >> because cigarettes are always bad for you . and that's the bad for you. and that's the point about banning cigarettes, is that there is no safe amount of smoking that you can do, whereas millions of people drink perfectly safely. and the studies on drink are inconclusive as to whether they have health benefits or health defects in moderation . defects in moderation. >> look, i agree that some of the studies are inconclusive, but things that we have learned recently, for example , things recently, for example, things like breast cancer, there's actually no such thing as a safe limit. so i agree that it's up to parents to decide what they want to do with their children. but i also think that if the world health organisation is saying that, you know, it damages children's brains at a young age , then it's worth young age, then it's worth taking that into account. >> and i agree with you that children should not be drinking excessively , they should only be

excessively, they should only be drinking very modest quantities. and i don't think even the world health organisation is saying that if people have a sip or they have half a glass that's going to damage them, it's the point you were making about children on a pathway to drinking, but that probably indicates other problems in the family anyway, doesn't it? well i think that i guess i would just see, like, why would you want your children to start drinking at 11? >> why not 18? >> why not 18? >> well, i'll tell you why. >> well, i'll tell you why. >> because i think that children who learn to drink sensibly are then going to be able to cope with it when they become old enough to drink under their own steam. it's not something that is forbidden . it's not the is forbidden. it's not the forbidden fruit. and there are lots of stories about america where people get to be able to dnnk where people get to be able to drink , and then all they want to drink, and then all they want to do is to get themselves drunk because it was forbidden. they couldn't do it. and i just think introducing things to people in a mature way is helpful. now, in my own case, i've got lots of children and i certainly

wouldn't let the younger ones drink. but the older ones don't actually like the taste. so the fact that it's there but they don't like it is , to my mind, don't like it is, to my mind, very positive because they will grow up knowing that they can dnnk grow up knowing that they can drink if they want to. but it's not this exciting forbidden thing. >> yeah, it's a difficult balance to get right because i understand the argument. if you make it forbidden, then it can become more attractive. and i'm not a fan of banning things because i don't think that has the right effect. but i also know from the work that i do in just a tonic that i speak to, you know, hundreds and hundreds of people. and one of the common themes that comes up is people talk about learning to rely on alcohol from an early age. nobody says, i'm glad i started drinking when i was younger. >> but do you think that is indicative of other problems within the household, or is it purely that the child is drinking? because it seems to me that if parents are allowing a child to have that much to drink , then that should be setting off alarm bells that social services should be looking into.

>> anyway, i think that you can have a very sensible attitude as a parent and you can allow your children to try it, but what the studies have shown that if we start drinking when we're going through things like puberty, some people, no matter how safe your family unit is , will will your family unit is, will will struggle with it. in those start to rely on it . to rely on it. >> but don't some people end up with a drinking problem who haven't had a drop until they're 18? but it's not as as simple? >> yeah. it's not. it's absolutely not black and white, but we do know that studies show that when we start relying on alcohol because, say we have social anxiety , it becomes social anxiety, it becomes a powerful learned behaviour. and i'm not saying that's the case for everyone, but the studies have shown that the younger people try it, and they've also shown that if people are allowed to drink at home, they're more likely to experiment outside as well . well. >> is that right? because i would have thought that if people are able to drink at home, then it's less exciting.

the point that if it's bad, it's more exciting, and if they're drinking outside the home, there are other laws that are there to protect them, which clearly aren't being enforced because they shouldn't be able to buy a drink, they wouldn't be buying it in the home, but they wouldn't be able to buy it in an off licence or in a pub. yeah. >> i mean, the studies have shown that if parents kind of condone it, then then people like, yes, in one hand people might say if it's not allowed, it makes it more attractive. and i've certainly got clients that have said that. but i've also had a lot of clients that have said that they've been allowed to drink from a very young age, and they feel that that was part of the reason they built a dependency. and ultimately, the final question who should decide? >> the parents or the state? >> the parents or the state? >> i think any parent wants to make that decision, but they want to make an informed decision, with, you know, things like the world health organisation that can give them helpful information. >> i think we agree. i want the parents to decide, but i want

them to have information. thank you so much, sandra, for coming on. coming up, you may have been fooled that keir starmers labour party is pro—business, but news today suggests the socialist impulse remains alive and kicking. plus is m16, a sheep in wolf's clothing pretending to be tough but really being unutterably wet. you won't believe the latest wokery that britain's spies are indulging

in. well, the mailbox have been pounng well, the mailbox have been pouring in, and adam says introducing youngsters to alcohol gradually is sensible. but pubs were better when they excluded children. groups should have their own spaces . just like have their own spaces. just like men. only clubs and women only places like the glorious women's institute and possibly also the garrick club. david on the face of it, it is concerning that this story smacks of being a precursor to banning alcohol. similarly to rishi's ridiculous tobacco ban. another unwelcome who interference. my children

always had a small glass at sunday dinner and are now very moderate drinkers and anthony, who is very blunt, says tell the w.h.o. to who is very blunt, says tell the who. to mind their own w.h.o. to mind their own business. mind your own beeswax. as people used to say. anyway, labour has promised to nationalise the railways within five years. if it wins the next election, could this be a great leap forward for the country's transport system, or returned the dark decades after the transport act of 1947, when the railways were brought under the control of clement attlee's socialist government? if this is to be the case, one would at least wish for a return of government issue . gammon and government issue. gammon and pineapple steak served on china in shabby, smoke filled dining cars. but who knows ? labour cars. but who knows? labour doesn't appear to have costed the plan because louise hague , the plan because louise hague, the plan because louise hague, the shadow transport secretary, couldn't even rule out price rises on the bbc's today programme. well, i'm joined now by my most intellectual panel, gb news senior political commentator nigel nelson, and the journalist and conservative peer paul goodman. nigel keir

starmer is marching us safely back to the 1940s. >> i think probably the railways have improved a bit since brief encounter, so we're probably not going all the way back there, it's a sensible thing to do. i happen to think that, all public utilities and services ought to be in public control, rather than giving money to shareholder , as it should be reinvested in the in those services . so what the in those services. so what he's what he's done today. it's promising . he's what he's done today. it's promising. i'm not he's what he's done today. it's promising . i'm not sure it'll promising. i'm not sure it'll come quite without any cost whatsoever . you'd have to come quite without any cost whatsoever. you'd have to pick up liabilities, debts, pension funds from the existing 14 operators. but it will make ticketing much simpler , to make ticketing much simpler, to make fares simpler, whether they'll go down or not remains to be seen, so it's a reverse of the clause four moment of tony blair, and it's bringing things back into public ownership, in spite of all the evidence that pubuc spite of all the evidence that public ownership runs things pretty poorly. >> well, there isn't i mean, i remember british rail towards the end, actually ran rather

rather well. there may have been times, times sort of in the 50s and 60s when it didn't, but certainly before it was it was privatised 30 years ago. i found british rail pretty good, but but i mean, i don't think that nationalisation is not kind of an ideological thing anymore. with labour, he scrapped the idea of, of the utilities, rail is the only thing on the list at the moment that is to be nationalised. >> no, paul, the one point that labour makes that i think is easy to make, but so fundamentally flawed is that profit is waste. profit is actually what you pay for efficiency. >> it's worth pointing out at the start , the system is the start, the system is actually so nationalised already. i mean, what we're talking about here is the trains and not the track, and there's been a tendency towards nationalisation since covid. but just getting back to the sort of thrust of your question, i think the weakness in the national nationalisation position is the answer to the question, where's the investment going to come from? because since privatisation happened, one,

there's been a massive expansion in the amount of rail travel. and two, the private sector has put up the money for much of the investment in it. so if the weakness or so—called weakness of the private solution is shareholders, the pluses you get the investment. and my challenge to labour would oh, be, so the investment is going to come from the treasury. is it be careful what you wish for. >> well, because there's already a £4 billion annual subsidy for the trains. and if you add investment on top of that for rolling stock and so on, that, that could go up by many billions. we're in a period following covid where we have got used since furlough and everything that's followed to the state and therefore the long term, the taxpayer shelling out for everything. >> but it's really not sustainable. i suspect with the levels of investment you're going to need to support railways, which after all, not always or even often profitable , always or even often profitable, still not profitable or necessarily very well run because the private sector

hasn't been able to get rid of the spanish practices which have beenin the spanish practices which have been in the railways for decades. >> they haven't been able to introduce driverless trains and things like that , they have, as things like that, they have, as nigel was saying, an immeasurably complex ticketing system. and they won't use the government's powers to allow them to break the strikes when they, in fairness to the apostles of nationalisation, railways are an unusual business. >> and, mrs. thatcher, lady thatcher, i should say, never privatised them. probably for precisely that reason. i think she thought they were intrinsically loss making , and intrinsically loss making, and therefore something the private sector should keep out of . but sector should keep out of. but as i say, what the private sector does bring to the table is the investment, even if it can't always deal with all the spanish practices . spanish practices. >> do you think a government, particularly a labour government, will be robust enough to deal with the spanish practices? >> yes. well i mean, there will be different because the one thing they will do is they'll sit down with the unions. and so it's something that. >> well, but experience tells you, sitting down with the unions doesn't help. well i mean

look at the 1970s. they bear and sandwiches at number 10. >> i'm not sure. >> you know, the unions have been the train drivers. unions are very, very obdurate . are very, very obdurate. >> but the transport secretary has not sat down with the trade unions for 18 months. good. but. well because it wouldn't change anything, but it did. but once we actually had negotiations going properly, the rmt ended their strike. i know we've still got aslef out there, but at least you've got the rmt sorted out. that could have been done earlier if you'd had proper negotiations. >> so that's naive. that aslef has earned that. aslef has very unreasonable requirements for what it wants, and the unions haven't given in on the spanish practices. so sunday is still voluntary. working day . voluntary. working day. >> but when it comes down to what happened with the rmt, there was a solution to that dispute cost a costly solution without sufficient improvements in working practices. >> well , the idea you want to >> well, the idea you want to get rid of, manned stations and so on. so on. >> so on. >> i don't think that's actually

a good way of dealing with working practices. i mean, how do disabled people operate? they'll make stations more dangerous. so it's not so much those things . there was a pay those things. there was a pay claim that went in. the pay claim that went in. the pay claim was sought out by negotiation. >> you see, i think nigel reveals why the labour party won't do anything about spanish practices because they actually believe the argument of the union that if you take a guard off a train, it makes a train. >> i do think, i do think up to a point it does depend on the union. i think in some cases, of course, you can talk to the unions and reach a settlement. one of the interesting things about this discussion is, we all assume almost without thinking about it, that it's natural to do business with lots of unions. you know, why aren't you doing business with a single union? and it was the weakness of the british trade union system in the 70s, precisely that you had lots of different unions out competing or trying to out compete each other with wage demands that brought down or weaken. so many of the governments in the 1970s. >> and however it happens. do you think the subsidy for rail

is justified? does £4 billion a year get value for the taxpayer against spending that money on other things? are the railways and outdated technology that actually is kept because we have actually is kept because we have a romantic attraction ? a romantic attraction? >> well, one of mrs. thatcher's main advisers at the time may remember an eccentric and colourful gentleman called sir alfred sherman believed in tarmacking over all the railways and turning them into the roads. but there is a conservative strand that doesn't see railways like that, and i confess i'm a part of it. they've sort of somewhat romantic idea of railways, even if they don't necessarily pay their way . of necessarily pay their way. of course, the government you've been supporting since 2019 really came in on quite a populist wave of reversing some of the beeching cuts to the railways in the 1950s and opening up new lines again. >> they're a service, aren't they? and the whole point of the railways is to be a service. we're not actually looking at something to make a profit. you

only start making wanting profits when you bring in the private sector. >> well, why not? airlines make a profit, motorcars make a profit . profit. >> well, airlines are motorcars are both in the private sector we're talking about. they make money. we're talking about something coming back into the pubuc something coming back into the public sector where it's good. they're good. >> anyway, thank you very much. my >> anyway, thank you very much. my panel coming up, more damning evidence has emerged proving our intelligence services have been infected by wokery . plus, the infected by wokery. plus, the man who turned the black lives matter on its head, tony lord sewell, will join me to discuss his book, the state of the nafions his book, the state of the nations book club

well, the mailbox have been steaming in. as you might expect. as we've been talking about trains, milan and ross say nationalising railways would be fine as long as the taxpayer funded railway employees agree that they will never strike. and cheney says whoever has control of the railway needs to have control of the unions as they

are at the bottom of all the problems. cheney, i think you're absolutely right. and this tells you where the labour party is in the hands of the unions again. and our young says riding the rails for many is a treat because it's so expensive now, there is no way prices can rise. if anything, the railways should be made more competitive with private competition. last year, state of the nation revealed the fact that m15 was being institutionally racist to white people by offering summer internships exclusively for non—white people, discriminating against over 90% of my constituents in somerset. but the infection of wokery in our intelligence services didn't end there . gb news us correspondent there. gb news us correspondent stephen edgington has released gb news investigates latest report. a leaked diversity document has shown spies are being to told avoid all white panels, use gender neutral bathrooms and nominate each other for 13 separate diversity awards. the document also shows that spies were told to avoid shaking hands with muslims and copy justin trudeau's hand on

heart technique to avoid offence. well, with me now is my all white panel, gb news senior political commentator nigel nelson and journalist and conservative peer paul goodman, so m16 , when we talk to you, i'd so m16, when we talk to you, i'd like to see the original reports. >> i mean, the summary is, is certainly intriguing, the bit of it i know just a very little bit about not not a lot is dealing with muslims. and really the answer is it depends . i'd like answer is it depends. i'd like to know who wrote this report. i mean, in a lot of cases, they often i think it's still to do with class shaking hands is perfectly unexceptional, some times it is, sometimes it isn't. and i just don't think reports like this should make the assumption that it isn't. >> no, i completely agree with that. and that people are also intelligent and sensitive. so if you go to japan, you slot into what i rather like this gentle bowing at people . i think it's bowing at people. i think it's extremely courteous and a friendly way of greeting. i

wouldn't mind at all if we adopted the japanese way of greeting people quite new. >> i will now sort of semi bow to you solemnly. >> just look more deeply because you are here and more senior than i am. >> i have to both of you . >> i have to both of you. >> i have to both of you. >> so. >> so. >> no, on this, on this one. i think that i used to work with the intelligence services a lot over the, over the years. they really pride themselves on their inclusivity and diversity , and inclusivity and diversity, and it's the right thing to do in the first place, but also it is actually good for the nation's security. you've got they're deaung security. you've got they're dealing with 70% of their their resources go on islamist terrorism. they need arabic speakers to listen to the internet chatter . internet chatter. >> you're about to well, that's so obviously right that they need arabic speakers, but they don't need to tell people patronising nonsense about the type of loos they should use and the people they've got on panels i >> -- >> no, but the point that that comes into the inclusivity thing that if you have gender neutral or ideally unisex toilets, i think that's what workplaces should have. so why should m15

or m16 be any different? >> this is hang on a sec. what are your devout muslims going to make of unisex toilets? toilets >> there you go. >> there you go. >> well, they can they can use them in the same way as anybody else. >> if they might not, they might not want to. and my point is, it's all about the sheer complexity of getting into this. once you start issuing guidelines, because a unisex toilet is actually they are separate, private areas. >> they're not they're not like like gender neutral toilets, which are much more open. these are places with their own washing facilities. they're all sealed up, so there'd be no problem for a muslim going in there. then anybody else they might not be. >> but the initial reaction of being told that you have to do something other than go to the male or the female, i think it's a conversation about lavatories and toilets, about not going to the standard male and female ones that you're used to. i mean , this might not be something that they want to do. >> no, it may not be. i presume that they they deal with those things inside both m15 and m16.

>> then they should deal. why do you need a guide to it? >> that's right, that's right. why do you need this guide when actually you've got to work out how people rub along with each other? and it's the patronising tone of it, but it's also don't have all, white male panels. well, there may be occasions when that's the right thing to have. there's the people who have. there's the people who have the expertise. >> well , it rather have the expertise. >> well, it rather depends on the panel, doesn't it? >> i think rather like paul. i'd rather like to read the full report on that, the idea of the idea of having a diverse panel seems an awful lot better. and bearin seems an awful lot better. and bear in mind, historically , vie, bear in mind, historically, vie, it has been a kind of middle class white type of organisation, and that's what they've been trying to change. well, the cabinet office has issued a statement. >> a spokesman said a lot of work has been done to review equality, diversity and inclusion spending across government, particularly over the last year. it is right taxpayers have value for money and we are considering a presumption against this type of spending in the civil service. well, that's excellent news. let's stop this sort of wasteful spending and let's have spies who get on with spying and

catching baddies rather than being woke like that fellow who said he was changing the garrick from the inside until he resigned the next morning and he was wet. wipe of the week. i forget his name, but he's m or c or m c squared, anyway, my apologies if my next segment causes you offence, but another classic british sitcom has fallen victim to the tedious trigger warning travesty the bbc's 19805 trigger warning travesty the bbc's19805 hit trigger warning travesty the bbc's 1980s hit terry trigger warning travesty the bbc's1980s hit terry and june, which follows the lives of an inoffensive, middle aged, middle class couple, is now available to watch on streaming platform britbox. however viewers are being warned that it contains discriminatory language of the period. are we not all weary of the sitcom snowflakes who have already labelled cult shows like hi—de—hi and fawlty towers with these silly trigger warnings? have they not grown tired of this woke nonsense? well, the great advocate of woke wokery on my panel. they never nonsense, nigel nelson, what are they doing? well i'd rather say a trigger warning put on these shows rather than have them

censored or not shown at all, so, i mean, some trigger warnings if they, if it says , warnings if they, if it says, oh, bad language and sex from the star, they're often acts like an advert or a great. well, watch. we'll watch that. like the romans in britain, which everyone went to because exactly. >> mary whitehouse. yes, exactly , but i don't see any harm in having a trigger warning at the beginning of any show to tell you what you're about to about to see, especially if you've got kids around. >> the reason i do is that it assumes people are idiots and they can't work out when they watch something, what it's likely to be. but if you want to watch terry and june, you can quickly google it, see what it's going to be about. you're done and dusted. you don't need a trigger warning, but why? why is the trigger trigger warning problem? >> because it's unnecessary. >> because it's unnecessary. >> but if people would be offended who don't know anything about terry and june, but fancy watching it anyway , it does also watching it anyway, it does also seem difficult to be offended by terry and june. >> i mean, i do remember watching it as a as a child about the least offensive thing on television. >> the general discussion is

quite interesting because there's a parallel with going to railway stations and seeing those signs that say , come up those signs that say, come up this way or go down that way, or hold on to the handrail. and i think what you're getting at is the same sort of debate, which is do we want to be, as you would say, and i think rightly, richly nana and shepherd around in this way that somehow assumes that we're not capable of doing, you know, of making a decision ourselves about what we see, or if climbing the staircase safely or or, you know, do we want to live in a country in a society where we're endlessly warned all the time about endless numbers of things and about things that may be obvious? >> comedy shows may have things in them that people don't like, and a lot of comedy is funny because it's, slightly marginal and being a bit cheery about the show. >> it's a terrible thing to say on tv. i've never actually seen it, but i do know that you can climb a stair at a railway

station, right? okay, safely. if you've got independence of judgement without having to have a notice that tells you, well, it may, it may be nigel, to your point that this trigger warning is going to boost viewings on britbox of terry and june with lots of people like paul who have never watched it before. >> yes, but but you don't know what you're getting. a trigger warning would actually give you give you an indication what's coming up. but we we've had sort of things like fawlty towers having a trigger warning on great that they don't cut scenes from that. but but some of those things, the example would be where, basil takes a step backwards when he sees a black doctor face to face. exactly the sort of thing basil would do. but that. but you know, he's a closet racist. it's fair to warn people a scene like that's coming up very funny, but it is fair to warn them. >> but do you think they need that? i mean, it's just this idea that people are so stupid. i don't think people are that stupid, but if they don't like it, they can switch off. >> we've all grown up with with fawlty towers. yes. people who haven't grown up with fawlty towers may indeed be offended. i think you warn people and say

don't watch it if it actually offends you, i'm afraid. >> i then feel, taaffe, that i don't see why they need to be spoon fed, that if they feel offended, they can switch off. well, but i just see why these tropes by which trigger warnings have actually you've actually seen something that's offensive . seen something that's offensive. >> every programme now is carrying something that tells you about the programme. i mean, in all modern television, everything you actually watch, they'll give you an idea what you're watching, which is why i don't think you need trigger warning. >> so it's just the fashion of the times that if there's going to be something that you think is going to be in that vogue, word or everywhere unacceptable to have a word, you have to be warned, it'll be unacceptable. but i am wondering what people in 30 or 40 years time will make of the way we're behaving now, just as the way some people think now, what on earth were they doing ? 30. they doing? 30. >> we'll have trigger warnings 30 or 40 years on the rebroadcast of state of the nation. >> there will be trigger warnings. i remember salman at farm street pointing out that unacceptable merely went wrong.

and if you meant wrong, you should say it. rather than using a i think weasel word is completely unacceptable and inappropriate and probably disappointing as well. well, thank you very much to my panel for their fantastic company this evening. the intellect burning away, coming up next, state of the nations book club returns with the former chairman of the commission on race and ethnic disparities, tony the lord sewell, who shattered the black lives matter narrative on race and equality. i'll be discussing black success. the surprising truth with the man himself. after the

break. well, i probably ought to say, as the male mugs were on m15 and six, that they're too secret to read out. but jeff has written in to say m15 and six are merely added to a long list of the british institutions captured by wokery time for a restoration of britain before its abolition. simon order of saint michael and saint george. omg, you couldn't anything more tame than terry

and june. whatever next? and greta, trigger warnings trigger me here. here. very fine point. well, in 2020, amidst the global backdrop of the black lives matter protests and riots following the murder of george floyd in the united states, the then prime minister boris johnson announced the commission on race and ethnic disparities, which was set up to investigate race and ethnic disparities in the uk . the black lives matter the uk. the black lives matter movement, primarily driven by critical race theory , advanced critical race theory, advanced the narrative that racial disparities are caused by discrimination . this was discrimination. this was a serious charge for a purportedly liberal country like the united kingdom. but as my next guest has argued, this is a debilitating narrative that denies ethnic minorities agency and responsibility. the commission on race and ethnic disparities , chaired by tony the disparities, chaired by tony the lord sewell, found that structural racism was not a key factor in determining racial disparities , shattering the disparities, shattering the prevailing consensus. his new book , black success the book, black success the surprising truth, builds on the

challenging of victimhood narratives exploring the untold stories of success, ambition, and achievement in britain's black community. state of the nafion black community. state of the nation book club starts now. well, i'm joined by the man himself, tony. the lord sewell, author of black success the surprising truth. tony, thank you so much for coming in, your bookis you so much for coming in, your book is really interesting because you actually spent your life making yourself and others successful . yeah. and that goes successful. yeah. and that goes away from the narrative that you're stuck in whatever you're born in, and you have obstacles that will prevent you ever moving out of the society you started with. >> that's right. and i think that what i've tried to do in the book and also to show, i mean, there's an irony in the title of black success because in the end, what we find out is it's nothing to do with being black at all. we've had race has

nothing to do with it at all. that's the irony of it. >> and i think that you're absolutely right that you come back in the end to your own agency, to your own kind of will to prevail. and also, i think in a sense, you affirm yourself, you know, and you don't allow, structures and systems to hold you back. i must correct one thing, though, in your intro, structural things that do exist, and i'm not here denying that there are a factor. i think what it is with that black lives narrative and some other narrative. it's this notion that this institutional, almost systemic thing that locks you in like a prisoner. >> and i was really interested because you've come to this report and to this book, having faced some challenges, that i was very struck, what you wrote about the 1981 brixton riots and you went to a christian church that was primarily white, and you felt they just didn't understand. and you stopped going there? >> yeah . look, i come back on >> yeah. look, i come back on reflection. i think they were

helpful and they really did a great job. and i have nothing against them. and i am not here in any way to feel or say to anybody around me or anything else that i had obstacles at all. yeah, but but yes, there was a point where you where after i mean, we've got to admit that those riots in 1981 were really linked to , to direct really linked to, to direct racism from the police. it was quite clear , however, we britain quite clear, however, we britain has changed, you know, 40 years on, whatever. we're a completely different world. >> and i love the stories about your mother, who's clearly inspired to you, and that when she went into the market, she was so tough. she got the best cuts of meat and my favourite story. she gets a job. what if your cousin, she goes to her boss and says, we need a job for this man? the boss says we haven't got any. he starts the next day. that's right. your mother must have been a wonderful influence. >> i always tell this story that you know this nonsense about white privilege. i mean, my mother was in a workplace, a

small, electronics manufacturing place, and there were, 30 white men, and she was the only black woman in there. the only woman. and i felt sorry for the 30 black white men in there because they. and they were there, they actually forget her birthday. but but but it's quite interesting . but she knew their interesting. but she knew their birthdays. yeah. and it was , it birthdays. yeah. and it was, it was this very dynamic relationship. so you could imagine my mother then kind of having that kind of power , you having that kind of power, you know, and not really dealing with this thing. yes. there was racism, but at the other hand, she, she just walked right through it. another thing about my mother was the interesting it's this notion all the time that you have to keep telling your children the world is against them. my mother kept telling me one thing. she said, tony, you're a genius. that's all i was so pleased to hear read that, because that's what i say to my children. >> and i think, and i think this gets the heart of what you were saying, both in your report in the book that actually it's family, isn't it? and you see the disappointing results of

white working class children that they don't have the family support and the family network thatis support and the family network that is telling them they can succeed . yeah. and some people succeed. yeah. and some people in other communities don't have that as well. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> i think what's happening here is there's not a distinction between disparities which are which are clear and have different reasons for having them. and discrimination where it's, you know, something that somebody deliberately stopping you from moving on. i'm quite disappointed when i do see, black celebrities or people like coming on and really , almost coming on and really, almost inventing stories. and sometimes those stories are not fair where they actually have to have some kind of jeopardy something stopping them. but jacob, i have no jeopardy story for you, i have nothing, i'm sorry. today, today i have to apologise for that. i the world, the white world is not against me today. you know, i can't. i can't give you that narrative because it's not in my experience. >> and you write about the wonderful west indies cricket side. that's right. i'm a little bit younger than you, but i

remember them in the 1980 rather than 1976. but i was obsessed by cricket when i was a schoolboy and read all about the 1976 matches and michael holding's amazing performance at the oval when he got eight wickets. yeah, and you're quite critical of him for then, saying it was all very tough. >> yeah. and i think that black lives matter thing didn't help in a sense, because i think he felt that. you see, what is interesting for him was that different things come out in crisis that are not necessarily what people tend to exaggerate them. so for example, i, i think his major crisis was what happened to him back in jamaica, where there was where there was colorism in his family. and this whole kind of race thing brought that out . but then to sort of that out. but then to sort of almost extrapolate that out to the whole of britain as against you is very strange because everybody loved michael holding. >> yes. i mean , he was a great >> yes. i mean, he was a great hero, right? >> somebody i admire enormously. the most beautiful bowling action. yeah, but i can't take everything back to cricket. i have a tendency to do this. i

was also very interested in what you wrote about the success of nigerians in your book, particularly southern nigerians, particularly southern nigerians, particularly christian nigerians. i think i may have marked a page about how important the christianity was and how they actually adopted it, and now bringing it back to re—evangelize england. >> that's right. the it's the it's the sort of new evangelism that they bring to it. but that evangelism is also infecting in the education system as well . in the education system as well. in fact, the education system, because you get you get, you get a sense that i mean, i'll just give you some quick numbers here. i mean, compared to the canbbean here. i mean, compared to the caribbean scores, those nigerian scores are a lot higher, you know, and they're the, the what part of the reason is that if you look at the caribbean story, we're running at 60, nearly 70% single parents where they're running nearly 30, 40% and they're in the same classrooms as those caribbean students, yet doing completely different. >> and again, family. that is important. and that's the thing

you point out, is that success builds success. so jamaica's wonderfully successful in terms of runners, not because they're some miracle gene, but because the school system is very competitive for running . nigeria competitive for running. nigeria is very good at scrabble because they're very competitive at scrabble. yeah. and this shatters a lot of the myths about inherited characteristics. >> that's right. and that's what you've got to do with this. it comes back then to the humanity story. yeah. and yet you got a pasting in the press for your report, it was as if you, i don't know , blowing a raspberry don't know, blowing a raspberry at the late queen. >> i think what happened? we were talking about this earlier was that a lot of people didn't read it a lot of people came to this story. they didn't read it. they had perceptions of it. some people were criticising it before it was even came out. you know, and i think what the report did was essentially did this. it made it said, look out there, racism does exist. we're not we're not naive to it. majority of us were were ethnic minorities on that report that did it . and what we found was did it. and what we found was that it was rooted in things

like geography, like, class , like geography, like, class, like, for example, your family background, these factors you had to take into consideration. >> well, tony, thank you very much for coming on. i would strongly recommend black success to any of my viewers, i'm now going to hand over to patrick. patrick, what have you got on your program this evening on the bill of fare? >> great show. jacob loads on its official the ministry of justice wants to hide how many asylum seekers are murderers and rapists. i'll be revealing what they've said to me very shortly. humza yousaf is on the way out. the french are apparently about to leave the calais beaches defenceless and are the police too fat to protect us? and your favourite, jacob sam smith is going to be performing at the proms. >> sam smith isn't he a brewer? i think there is a sam smith's brewery in yorkshire , so that'll brewery in yorkshire, so that'll be more. nigel farage's ticket. that's all coming up after the weather. i'll be back on monday 8:00. i'm jacob rees—mogg. this has been saved. nation and the weather in somerset will be

fantastic. glorious, wonderful . fantastic. glorious, wonderful. >> a brighter outlook with boxt solar sponsors of weather on gb news . news. news. news. >> good evening. here's your latest gb news. weather forecast brought to you by the met office. it's going to be another rather chilly night for many of us, and there will be some showers around and more showers to come as we go through tomorrow. due to an area of low pressure just out in the north sea, bringing a showery theme to many places. some further showery rain through this evening and overnight across southern parts. and here it is going to stay pretty cloudy, keeping temperatures up elsewhere. there will be some clearer skies further north, albeit with a few showers around across some northern and eastern coastal parts , perhaps the odd coastal parts, perhaps the odd wintry one over the higher ground of scotland, where we see the skies clear. we are going to see temperatures dropping so they will fall a few degrees below freezing in some rural spots. a touch of frost for some of us first thing tomorrow morning. otherwise, as we go through tomorrow, staying pretty cloudy across some far southern areas and watch out for some

heavy, perhaps even torrential downpours across parts of the southwest into the afternoon. elsewhere, the showers across the far north and east will become more widespread, feeding inland, so a greater chance that many of us will catch one into the afternoon temperatures staying a little bit on the low side. not feeling too bad in the sunshine, otherwise a bit cool for the time of year into saturday and there will be some showery rain feeding its way northwards across parts of england and wales. could be a little bit heavy at times. also a scattering of showers for northern and western parts of scotland and northern ireland, but in between these two areas staying largely dry . there may staying largely dry. there may even be some sunshine at times. sunday brings some heavy , sunday brings some heavy, persistent rain to some eastern southeastern parts, but temperatures are gradually climbing by. >> by looks like things are heating up. boxt boilers sponsors of weather on

gb news. >> it's 9 pm. i'm patrick

christys tonight . the uk is christys tonight. the uk is flooding ireland with illegal immigrants . as this asylum immigrants. as this asylum seeker killed an old man . and. seeker killed an old man. and. all the police who fat to protect . us. humza yousafs protect. us. humza yousafs government just imploded . plus . government just imploded. plus. are we getting this filth from sam smith at the proms? also . sam smith at the proms? also. is france about to leave the calais beaches unprotected