website or facebook. don't make it me, because i'm a liberal, okay? give me a break. i can't take it. >> dana: weigh in and let us know who you think it can be done. we think it's bob. that's it for "the five." thank you for watching. see you tomorrow. >> john: is it a tax or a penalty? both sides can't seem to keep it straight. this is "special report." >> john: good evening. i'm john roberts in for bret baier. romney's campaign veered offmessage. every other republican leader seized on the supreme court healthcare ruling. pounding the president's individual mandate as a massive tax increase on americans. but an advisor to mitt romney said the governor doesn't see it that way. in fact, he suggested romney sees it just as the president does.

which left the romney campaign scrambling for clarification. ed henry reports. >> reporter: barely 24 hours after the top republican claimed the healthcare plan is a massive tax, adopted by the romney undercut the argument and let the president off the hook saying on msnbc the mandate in romney's own plan was not a tax. >> the governor believes that what we put in place in massachusetts was a penalty. he disagrees with the court's ruling that the mandate was a tax. >> he believes that he shouldn't call the tax penalty a tax. you should call at it penalty or a fee or a fine. >> that is correct. >> reporter: romney camp tried to back pedal from advisor eric bernstrom comment with a statement that did not clarify and instead tried to deflect saying the federal individual mandate in obamacare is either a constitutional tax or an unconstitutional penalty. governor romney thinks it is an unconstitutional penalty. what is president obama's

position? is his federal mandate unconstitutional or is it a tax? on that point, republicans had been united. >> it's a tax. the court said it's a tax. >> the tax will be levied. 77% of it on americans making less than $120,000 a year. >> white house chief of staff jack lew had been on the defensive. >> this is a tax -- >> that is not what the supreme court said. wait a minute, sir. >> 1% choose not to buy insurance, they call at it tax. >> no tech nick lick what they said is congress has many powers. commerce clause, taxing powers and it was constitutional. that's what they said. they said it doesn't matter what you call it. >> democrats twisted it to a pretzel, congresswoman nancy pelosi couldn't quite keep it straight. >> no, it's not a tax on american people. it's a penalty -- >> plus, the president flip-flopped from 2008. >> hillary clinton is attacking but what she is not telling you about the healthcare plan.

it forces everyone to buy insurance, february you can't afford it. you pay a penalty. >> it will be tough for romney to make the case when even his fellow republicans have a hard time defending him. >> gor romney speaks for himself about what he does for massachusetts. >> romney tries to make a big splash for the promise. how the health insurance premiums have not come down as promised before that was overshadowed by the remarks. another sign of tricky issue for them. john? >> ed henry at the white house for us. thanks. senior political analyst brit hume is here with his thought ox the penalty credit. good evening. >> welcome back. >> thank you. >> the fumblin fumbling in the y camp today explaining the governor's position on the supreme court finding that the healthcare fine is a tax is certainly embarrassing. it will be seen that the governor is unable to use the healthcare tissue his advantage. that doesn't mean that the issue will not work to his advantage anyway. that's because romneycare is

unpopular as ever and the president owns it. it is his signature achievement and for much of the first two years he set aside all other priorities including the economy to push it through congress. romney meanwhile has pledged to repeal it. despite the healthcare skeleton in his closet. the question is this. will voters who want to get rid of obamacare, vote for obama because they have misgivings about the romney record on the issue? it's like the economy. democrats take comfort from poles that show people blame president bush for the reinvestigation. but that is the wrong question. because the same people may also blame president obama for his failure to fix it. indeed, the polls suggest they do exactly that. which explain the job approval on the economy. the two issues are a burden on the incumbent. they are part of his record. if history is any guide, that record will decide the election. john? >> john: brit, what do you make of the conservative backlash against the chief justice or the decision he made regarding healthcare. and "b," this idea that he

changed his position? >> the sentment among conservatives isn't unanimous. it's strong. the evidence is strong as well that his fellow court conservatives were furious with him. there were inkals of that in the opinion itself. things are leaking out that he changed his position. something that almost never happens in the supreme court. can best be explained by the idea that the fellow conservativconservatives are did in him. but i don't think they have seen the last of him. >> john: i suspect they haven't. but early summer drama will go through the convention. good to see you. north carolina to new jersey, far west as illinois, 2 million people are without power. amid sweltering summer temperatures. emergency crews are racing to respond to deadly aftermath of a major storm system. chief congress correspondent mike emanuel is away from his usual post today. he is live in riverdale park, maryland, with the latest. good evening, mike. >> reporter: good evening, john.

at this apartment complex, part of the roof was ripped off and debris smashed cars like this one behind me. when you see the damage, the death toll shows that people are in the parking lot, in shelters wondering when the weather nightmare will be over. clean up, starting repairs and work on restoration of electricity are underway three days after straight line of thunderstorms wreaked havoc from the midwest to mid-atlantic. millions have been left without air conditioning and refrigeration in the blistering july heat. as time goes on there is concern for the elderly including those in senior apartment complexes who risked being stranded without an elevator. >> quite a few of them depend on tit's not good to use the s r stairs. so either they didn't go down to community room or they wouldn't able to go out. >> reporter: there is a recognition that many were lucky for close calls.

>> i was so glad nobody got hurt. >> hit with widespread outages to main plant and substations are reluctant to make promises to cus customers they may not be able to keep. they are making robo calls to break the bad news. >> i wasn't sure to laugh or cry when i heard the response. >> today, the mayor of washington, d.c., lost his cool with a local electrical utility. >> restoring power. to me, anyway, it's unacceptable. the speed of their response has been disappointing. frankly, i think most would agree that it's not good enough to be able to restore power to our people here in the city. >> reporter: meteorologists including fox's janice dean predicts more hot days ahead. >> 100-degree range and if you factor in humidity it will feel proo pressive again. in some cases so 5 to

110-degrees is what it feels like. >> people are trying to look out for one another. >> the fact that the power is out, people are sticking together. and coming closer together just because the power is out. bring them together. in a strange type of way. >> our cruiser brought in from as far away as florida and texas and canada to try to help restore service. dominion power in nearby virginia says it restored service to 750,000 customers out of the million that lost power. they are hopeful to have another significant jump tomorrow. but some disturbing information from meteorologists who warn the effected area from kentucky to new jersey could suffer a blast of severe weather again on the fourth of july. >> that is not good news. any new concerns that you're hearing from authorities as the day goes on and the high temperatures continue? >> they are worried about the very young and the very old. we heard from a virginia

hospital that said they are worried about elderly people perhaps suffering from food poisoning as the days go by, because their food may have gone bad and may not realize it and may go to the hospital sick with food poisoning. that is another thing on the lookout in days ahead. >> john: mike, for those people who don't have power, the homes are unlivable because they're so hot is there anyplace for them to go, county and local governments arranged? >> reporter: there are a number of shelters set up. these people have been moved to nearby school where they are riding out the storm. some of them are frustrate and they would like to come back. the power has not been restored here. they'd like their possessions and belongings back in their home. authorities are thinking it's better for them to be in a shelter where there is plenty of water and also some cooling to keep them cool with the hot temperatures. >> john: make sure you drink a lot of water. dehydration is a big problem in times like these. mike emanuel for us. thanks so much. the family of one crew member

says military officers told them just two of the six people on board military cargo plane survived after a crash in south dakota on sunday. the plane was one of eight on loan from charlotte to fight wildfires in the state. it crashed after dropping the load of fire retardant. no cause of the crash at this point. remaining -- the remaining aircraft, the remaining seven have been grounded as a precaution. firefighters continue to battle blazes all across the west, including the 150-square mile fire in utah. showing no signs of stopping. 265-square mile blaze to the highway in montana. air bus announced it will build an assembly plant in alabama. giving the european aerospace giant the first foothold in the united states to compete with rival boeing. the plan is expected to cost $600 million to build. and will employ 1,000 people at full production.

your tax dollars for old fashioned writing. that is later on in the grapevine tonight. up next, egypt's new president is saying the right things. there is a giant elephant in the room. we'll explain. ♪ ♪ ♪ [ male announcer ] what's the point of an epa estimated 42 miles per gallon if the miles aren't interesting? the lexus ct hybrid. this is the pursuit of perfection. syou know, i've helped a lot off people save a lot of money. but today...( sfx: loud noise of large metal object hitting the ground) things have been a little strange. (sfx: sound of piano smashing) roadrunner: meep meep. meep meep?

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only at your ford dealer. so, to sum up, you take care of that, you take care of these, you save a bunch of this. that works. >> john: in international news, the arab league called for syrian rebels to unite against the government forces of president bashar assad. the arab league lead meeting

follows international conference in geneva that accepted kofi annan's plan to end the country's crisis. estimates say 800 people were killed in fighting last week alone. the newly elected egyptian president mohammed morsi indicated he will honor the country's international treaty. there are still concerns, however, about other members of his government. senior white house foreign affairs correspondent wendell goler explains. >> reporter: after thousands of years of land of the pharaohs and decades under dictators they worry it could be brief. >> with the islamist party, because they're revolutionary, that is they seek to change society, as they have been governed, the fear you will get one man, one vote, one time. >> dr. shockey feels that mohammed morsi and muslim brotherhood rise owes much to the candidate aligned with hosni mubarak and the military. but the result is that the

second largest recipient of u.s. foreign aid is led by a group with past ties to the terrorist group hamas and may need to adjust the peace treaty with israel and has members that support shariah law that could mean fewer rights for women. >> no american president can support egypt that calls in to question the historic treaty between israel and egypt. and no american president can support an egypt that doesn't fully recognize women's rights or the rights of religious minorities. >> reporter: some experts think egypt military will question the government to keep the peace treaty with israel and do so without controlling the government. >> they don't want to run things now because egypt is headed for real economic problems in the next year. >> the brotherhood may be less predictable and they promise not to run candidate for parliament or president that ran well in both. it's also the main opposition group in jordan and tunisia and may lead syria after the fall of assad.

some worry that the government will succeed, shockey worries it will fail to bring prosperity and that will bring a new fear. >> politics can fix this. routine way we govern society can't fix this. you need violent insurgency. that narrative may take hold as people get discouraged and despair. >> shockey calls it the al-qaeda narrative and egypt would be the biggest prize. >> john: wendell goler at the state department tonight. current tally stands, mexico's next president is member that held party through 20th century, through corruption and patronage. what do we expect? william la jeunesse puts the presumed leader in perspectiv perspective. >> they woke up to the 19th president. he is a former governor with record of tax reform and public works. politically he is a centrist,

pragmatist and politician who plans to open the national oil company to u.s. exploration and supports comprehensive immigration reform for mexicans illegally in the u.s. the incoming president is married to soap opera star and overcame allegations of fathering a child out of wedlock and an affair. >> the prove he is different. if he succeeds, i think a lot of people will show their loyalty to him. >> he defeated the leftist abradore and mota, mexico's first female presidential candidate. jarring defeat by the party. with which ruled mexico for 71 years through corruption, cronyism and vote rigging, a history the new president promises not to repeat. >> if they want to stay there after six years they have to adapt to the new societal

needs in mexico. >> u.s. officials fear he will return to the practice of cutting deals with the drug cartels, agreeing not to interfere with trafficking in exchange for less bloodshed. in the campaign, he promised to reduce violence but wasn't sure how. reassuredly, mexican is bringing in coalmost byian advisors as sur gate gates for . -- surrogates for the u.s. it is up to him to show he is a reliable partner in drug war. >> john: william la jeunesse in mexico city. european leaders face challenges after friday's summit hailed by investors worldwide. euro zone unemployment is at a record high, 11.1%. six countries in the euro zone including spain and italy are in recession. senior european central bank official urged greece's government to avoid further delay implementing major structural reports. american manufacturing shrank in june for the first time in nearly three years, sign that

the american economy continues to sputter. stocks were mixed today. dow lost nine, s&p 500 up 3. nasdaq added 16. still ahead, states battle back against implementing the president's healthcare plan. first, history in the private sector has come up before. but when exactly did governor romney stop working for bain capital? i've been fortunate to n on golf's biggest stages. but when joint pain and stiffness from psoriatic arthritis hit, even the smallest things became difficult. i finally understood what serious joint pain is like. i talked to my rheumatologist and he prescribed enbrel. enbrel can help relieve pain, stiffness, and stop joint damage. because enbrel, etanercept, suppresses your immune system, it may lower your ability to fight infections. serious, sometimes fatal events including infections, tuberculosis, lymphoma, other cancers, and nervous system and blood disorders have occurred. before starting enbrel, your doctor should test you for tuberculosis and discuss whether you've been to a region where certain fungal infections are common.

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>> john: the obama campaign is restarting what may sound like a familiar line of attack. governor romney's old firm bain capital outsourced a slew of jobs. what is new, though, is the claim that romney continued working there after he said he left. here is chief washington correspondent james rose within the story. >> shame on you, barack obama.

>> revisiting the last democratic primary, the romney campaign latest ad on the air in ohio portrays president obama as the purveyor of "vicious lies." >> the "washington post" says on every level that ad is misleading and untrue. >> he cited this article in the "washington post" last month that alleged that the trend of outsourcing american jobs to countries in the '90s pioneered by half dozen companies where bain capital invested. >> does iowa want outsourceer in chief in the white house? >> ceos of six companies say they added jobs in america while romney was at bain and the use of foreign call centers and packaging plant was to have existing sales. then fact check.org weighed in and said we found no evidence to support claim that romney running bain capital shifted jobs overseas. >> what the romney campaign and others tried to do is to

extract mitt romney from his tenure at bain. some of the jobs were shift overseas after 1999. the fact is that mitt romney is ceo and sole owner of bain capital through 2001. >> sources say romney never referred to the firm and play nod role after february of 1999. obama campaign uploaded the disclosure forms that showed romney in 2001 continuing to list bain and the various subsidiaries as the employer often with him as sole owner. the same form shows romney lifting the position with bain as the former executive and specifying that the role was passive with no management capacity. >> a lot of money is involved here. >> bill burton, the former obama white house aid, running a left wing super pack, priorities usa, sought to explain why the obama-biden team has not met its own fundraising goal. >> large number of folks supporting president obama but have been sitting on the sidelines. they look at mitt romney and say is really going

to beat president obama? >> reporter: 20 years ago, incumbent president george h.w. bush apologized after referring to the clinton-gore ticket as the two bozos. he told me he was conjuring the voice of democrats who don't take romney serious enough and added he regards romney as formidable candidate. >> john: there was an unusual fundraising pitch by the president today. what can you tell us about that? >> reporter: he was aboard air force one friday night returning to the capital. he used a special phone that the campaign pays for to speak to group of prior donors. the truth is that the early money is more valuable than late money the president told the donors. it's fair to say if we wait to the last minute we could be in for a rude surprise. "i have gray hair," he added. "people are disappointed because they had a vision of change happening immediately and turns out it's hard." one of the callers recorded

the conversation. >> john: we are hearing about travel arrangements for romney? >> he was slated to attend the summer olympics in london. we have confirmed that he plans to visit israel this summer for the second time in two years. and the fourth time in all. romney argued that president obama's midwest policies effectively thrown the jewish state "under the bus." a charge the obama administration vigorously rejects. >> john: we'll be following that as well. james rosen tonight. thanks so much. democratic new york congressman charles rangel's primary win over state senator espiot is in jeopardy. but the court fight is on hold for now. espiot believes there is a problem with transparency, something that rangel's champ denies. esaillat's attorney wants to show how unofficial returns with more than 40 showed no ballots cast. it's narrowed to 2% with 2,000 still to be counted. if it shrinks to one half of

1%, there will be a recount that could take weeks. rangel is going for his 2 2:0 2d term after facing house censure for ethics violation. the epa administrator who bragged he would crucify energy creators has a new gig. we'll tell you what it is. wait phenomenal you hear what the white house chief calligrapher makes for the fancy writing. the grapevine is next.

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check out our new mobile app. now you can use your phone to scan your car's vin or take a picture of your license. it's an easy way to start a quote. watch this -- flo, can i see your license? no. well, all right. thanks. okay, here we go. whoa! no one said "cheese." progressive mobile -- insurance has never been easier. get a free quote today. >> john: now some fresh pickings from the political grapevine. despite sluggish job market salaries are up at the white house. last friday, administration released the annual report on staff salary. this year, the payroll stands at $37.8 million and covers 468 employees. that is up slightly from last year and higher than president george w. bush's last year in office in 2008. the staff salaries totaled

$33 million and 447 employees. if you are in the market for a new career, you might want to think about calligraphy. schools may abandon cursive writing in class but the white house chief calligrapher makes almost $97,000 a year. that is something to write home about. the former environmental protection agency official who was caught on tape comparing the agent enforcement philosophy for oil and gas to ancient rome found a new gig. he resigned in april after his crucifyed comments became public. he will now work as part of the sierra club beyond coal campaign. oklahoma republican senator inhoff whose office first publicized the comment sent out a tongue and cheek congratulations. he said -- he won't get in trouble for

the true agenda to kill oil, gas and coal. another citizen that thinks 911 is customer service hotline. we told you last month a connecticut man called emergency dispatchers to complain his sandwich order was made incorrectly. now topping that, ohio man is facing criminal charges after he allegedly made ten calls to 911 to complain about service at local skyline chili restaurant. they say christian luckett was drunk at the time. our top story at the bottom of the hour. description of the healthcare mandate has a penalty or a tax contentious between parties and especially between governor romney and fellow republicans. barring repeal, the healthcare law will be fully implemented. a number of states say not so fast. correspondent shannon bream has more. >> reporter: across the country states that fought the president healthcare law are considering whether to walk

out door that the supreme court left cracked open for them. under the law as it was drafted millions of new medicaid recipients could be added to the state's current roles. under the threat that states refuse to comply could lose unrelated federal medicaid funds. upholding the expansion itself, chief justice roberts wrote for court, "what congress is not free to do is to penalize states that choose not to participate in that new program by taking away the existing medicaid funding." that left many states to consider whether or not to comply with the medicaid expansion. for florida, the answer is no. even though the federal government will initially foot most of the bill. >> every federal program ultimately cuts back. you create dependency, like with the schools and the stimulus. they cut back. we'll do the right things for our citizens. >> the national association of medicaid directors have been feeling calls nearly nonstop since the court's opinion was released on thursday. state's debate what to do

next. executive director matt sailo. >> i think the courts knew this would change the seat of power from d.c. to the state counties. >> states concerned that federal fund to expansion will try up after the state committed to take on new recipients are right to worry. lawmakers on capitol hill continue to battle how to reduce federal expenditures. >> states know that it's easy, easy target for federal savings is to go after that enhanced match and take away some or a lot of it. they are keeping that in mind. >> governor of louisiana, south carolina and wisconsin have also indicated they have no plans to take part in the medicaid expansion. if those four governors opt not to expand medicaid the decision would make nearly 1.7 million uninsured uneligible to join medicaid roles as planned for in the

healthcare law. >> john: shannon bream tonight. thanks. glaxo-smith-kline will pay $3 billion in combined civil and criminal fines, the largest healthcare fraud settlement ever. the company will plead guilty for promoting two popular drugs for unapproved uses in illegal practice known as off-baseball marketing. glaxo-smith-kline ceo andrew witty expressed regret and said they learned from mistakes that were made. most republicans are now calling the healthcare mandate a tax. all with one notable exception. the party's presidential candidate. the fox all-stars weigh in up next. pass, corporate card, verizon 4g lte phone. the global ready one ? yeah, but you won't need... ♪ hajimemashite. hajimemashite. hajimemashite. you guys like football ? thank you so much. i'm stoked. you stoked ? totally. ... and he says, "under the mattress." souse le matelas. ( laughter ) why's the new guy sending me emails from paris ? paris, france ?

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♪ ♪ believes that what we put in place in massachusetts was a penalty. and he disagrees with the court's ruling that the mandate was a tax. but again -- >> so he agrees with the president, but he agrees with the president that it is not an -- he believes you

shouldn't call the tax penalty a tax. you should call it a penalty or a fee or a fine? >> that's correct. >> john: it is confusing no matter how you slice it. that is romney's advisor disagreeing with the supreme court of the united states that the individual mandate and obama healthcare plan is a tax, saying rather it's a penalty. let's bring in the panel. jeff zel nearbyr for the "new york times." juan williams, of course, columnist with the hill and syndicated columnist charles krauthammer is here. so there is a question, is it a snacks is it a penalty in you can have your view on that. charles, start with you. you don't even think that the romney campaign should be talking about that. >> this attempt to be consistent and ledge call on the issue is a mistake. even chief justice roberts and his opinion is totally twisted and trying to decide if it's a tax or a penalty. at one point in the decision he says that for the purposes

of the constitution it's a tax but for the purposes of the anti-injunction act, arcane reason that it should be invalid in the first place it's not a tax, it's a penalty. so even he didn't have it straight. don't worry about getting in a twist over this. forget about consistency. use whatever end of the argument you need at the time. that's exactly what democrats are doing. what romney ought to say is okay, it's a tax. it's like many of the other taxes heaped on you by obamacare, the augmentation of the capital gains tax, the tax on medical devices, every time you need a stent you are paying a tax on this. this is one of many things that you have to do to sustain a system, a law, that the cbo said will cost $1.76 trillion. you c v to tax people for that. this is one of the many taxes. run with that. then use other arguments in other places.

try to square a circle that even roberts isn't able to is a mistake. >> john: bernstrom went on to say that at least the governor is being consistent. cag it a penalty in massachusetts and the state's healthcare plan and calling it penalty under proposed federal plan. meantime, president obama said it's not a tax and argued with the supreme court, solicitor general it is a tax and now saying it's not a tax. who is right, who is wrong? >> let's cut away from the political talk. it's a tax if that is what you want to say. this is intended to be incentive for people to get health insurance or disintentive for people who say i'd rather not have health insurance. however you want to put it. we have a lot of tax incentive built in the code. we encourage people to have children, own a home. it could go on. charles and i were discussing last week, in fact, employers get a tax deduction for providing healthcare to employees. some people don't like that. this is all part -- if you

want to put it in purely honest language, you can say, it's a tax. >> john: why won't the president acknowledge it? >> romney and the president are politicians. john, they understand that to say something is a tax can be toxic in political terms. people will be immediately opposed. romney didn't call it in massachusetts, obama doesn't call it that. >> john: what effect do you think it will have on the campaign going forward? >> i think juan is right. if the president were to say it's a tax, he would be violating one of the central promises he made over and over and over in 2008. saying the middle class would not be taxed one extra cent, unextra penny. i think the voters are not going to be moved onther this way. i think if you think the healthcare ruling with auz good thing, if you are a democrat, you probably think it's fine. if you are on the other side, republican you think it's not.

there is not much upside. he was trying to draw a line between the argument that republicans are making over the weekend, republican leaders made over the weekend. they know it's dangerous to get drawn into this. governor romney sort of accuse of imposing the tax in massachusetts. i don't think that spokesman misspoke this morning. >> john: when you look at the way it's all come out, after what bernstrom said, mitt romney and president obama are on the same track. mitt romney is on a completely different track than republican leadership. thereon what they said in the last couple of days about this. >> it's not a tax. >> the court said it was a tax. >> president said it's not a tax. supreme court has the final say says it is a tax. >> is it the largest tax in america's history. >> john: that point, that last point is probably debatable. charles, when you look at the split between mitt romney and the republican party and you look at the alignment with the obama campaign, they have some

explaining to do here. >> he does. that's why i think this is a classic case where consistency and intellectual honesty is a mistake. simply accept what the supreme court has said. it's a tax. forget about the attack on massachusetts. people will decide on obam obamacare. say it's a tax. it's one of dozens that you have to have to pay for the huge unworkable, essentially government run healthcare. and then move on to all the other issues involved with obamacare. intrusiveness. the getting in the way between patient and the doctor. what it will do to the economy and deficit, et cetera. i don't think you get stuck on this issue. mention it now and move on. there is no way to square the circle on this. don't attempt it. >> what about that last statement that this is the biggest tax increase in history?

juan, jeff, go with that. >> i think in fact, the polif polifacts and the "washington post" say it's one of the pants on fire lie of all timess. if you look at the size of the tax increase it's small compared to anything, percentage of gds just not true. >> but if you add the other taxes in obamacare together it's huge. >> this is -- you can add all the other taxes on -- >> 1.7 -- >> you are trying the pile on. >> pile on? it's all in the bill. >> even right now, this is just not going to determine the outcome ofthe election. this is not the issue. >> john: all right. >> i think it's up to the voters. everyone has made their mind up on the tax issue. i don't think we are moving voters through. voters in the center of the debate, the independent swing voters i don't think will be moved by the argument. a few week weeks from now neithr obama or romney will talk

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mitt romney was an outsourcing pioneering. he profited from companies that were on the front line of sending jobs overseas. that shaped the economic philosophy he would bring in the oval office. he would be outsourcer in chief. >> barack obama's attack against mitt romney are just not true. the "washington post" says on about every level this ad is misleading, unfair and untrue. that's barack obama. >> john: talking about this earlier in the program. what exactly did mitt romney leave -- when exactly did mitt romney leave bain capital and

was he responsible for outsourcing jobs there? back where the panel. the idea he is the "outsourceer in chief," fact check looked at this and said absolutely not true. >> no, what they said was for example, the "washington post" was challenged on this fact. the question is he sending the jobs overseas or were steps take than led companies then to organize themselves so that new jobs were created overseas? that is the very thin line. the fact is that new jobs were created overseas. >> john: what they said about the ad from the obama campaign was that it was an overreach. >> well, gee, i think we are playing politics here. of course it's overreach. overreach on both sides. here is the really relevant fact, chief justice roberts, the relevant fact is it works. if you look right now at the battleground states, according to a "wall street journal"/nbc poll last week, romney's reputation is taking a hit on the basis of these ads and his record at bain.

>> john: jeff, stephanie cutter who is with the obama campaign wrote a six-page letter to fact check saying that its analysis was not credible. was she right? >> it depends how you parse this. the obama ads are overstating what the "washington post" story said. but the interesting point of this is that the romney campaign response to this. probably the first example of a clumsy response to this took them several days to respond directly to the "washington post" but going there and demanding retraction. finally, romney campaign is now, is opening up a new ad campaign against the president. accusing him of negative attack. cast him as a politician. to me, that's a sign the ads are working. if they are true or false, they're somewhere in the middle here. the response on this to the romney campaign has tried to be above this. it's probably not working out all that well for them. because the attacks right or

wrong are hurting him a little bit. >> john: fact check just responded, minutes ago, to stephanie cutter's letter saying her arguments are all wet. if this were to stick on mitt romney, charles, could that hurt him in the all-important swing states? >> of course it will hurt him. this would be a case of the triumph of mendacity. this is an outright lie. factcheck.org. the quote is "we found no evidence to support the claim that romney and bain capital shipped jobs overseas." if you accuse him of investing in companies overseas because there is a growth in jobs overseas and at home that isn't a negative. but it's being called a negative, called shipping jobs overseas. this is simply not right. they also accuse romney and they call him a corporate raider. that term is used for hostile takeovers. he was not engaged in hostile takeovers. this is an out and out untruth.

romney was late in responding. it will certainly hurt him if he doesn't respond. i think he has to come out and say it's a lie and be absolute in that, in that kind of response. he couldn't look for middle ground. >> john: let me add here that the "washington post" did not retract its story. >> john: let's move on to one other story we can kick around tonight. on friday, the president made a rather unusual fundraising call from air force one on a special phone is paid for by the campaign of which he reached out to donors who supported him previously and wanted him to max out to him as soon as possible. is he running scared in the fundraising front? >> he should be. as he said in the call, according to what we know of it, he is an incumbent and this is the first time incumbent doesn't have a fundraising advantage. if you look at the superpacs, they're outperforming the superpac of the democratic side. he has a slight lead in terms of money raised by the campaign. romney is is not spending the money and benefiting from the

expenditure from the super pac. >> one of the spokes people, bill burton that heads up a list of communication on the superpac said this on msnbc. >> large number of folks that support president obama on the sidelines, they look at mitt romney and they say is this clown really going to beat president obama? >> john: that's not the first time a president was called a clown. bush said my dog knows more than these two bezos speaking of president clinton and vice president gore. the president says he wants early money rather than late money. is that more effective in campaign or is he playing a block in defense? >> he wants all money, now and later. the reason he has to make a phone call like that is he has democratic doe nores out there. it's not just wall street -- democratic donors out there. it's not just wall street. small donors who aren't

contributing. he needs money now because they are trying to define mitt romney. he still needs primary money in this primary phase of the campaign to run the television advertisements because the democratic super pac, wealthy donors are not stepping up to the plate here. the rules are the same on both sides. democrats, donors on the priorities usa superpac are not giving. he needs early money and late money. >> we have 45 seconds left here. if the president doesn't get that money to get the ads out, prior to the convention is he going to be in trouble? if you look at the fact that mitt romney raised $16 million more than the obama campaign in may. >> i think he would be in trouble if that happened. i think if he is running low on money, what he ought to do is to call it a tax. [ laughter ] then you don't get it. i'm sure lawyers can find a way to do it. supreme court justice will uphold it. look, this is punishment. he broke the rules in 2008.

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>> >> finally tonight, last week's healthcare ruling has left people wondering who will be cover and what will be be covered under the law. take a look at this public service announcement from one late night show. >> the supreme court ruling on healthcare means americans like you and me will be contributing money to pay for everything, from preventative tests for seniors to regular doctor visits for children. unfortunately, we're going to have to pay for idiots like this, too. [ laughter ] >> is it a tax or a penalty, ar