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is with us to talk about a new survey of teen views on k-12 education. what is edchoice? guest: it is a nonprofit national bipartisan organization launched in 1996. our mission is to advance freedom, opportunity and choice for all k-12 students and for them to lead successful lives in a stronger society. we seek to build awareness and understanding of school choice issues and the broader k-12 education ecosystem that can empower families to access and choose and the learning environment that best meets the needs of their children. we inform policymakers, peer groups, education leaders and entrepreneurs, public policy and legal affairs, medication

advocacy, workshops, trainings and outreach. and i lead a research team. host: your group conducted a survey that we are talking about this morning. why did you want to do the survey? guest: this is the eighth time we have surveyed teenagers in the u.s., a series of surveys we started back in the fall of 2020 at the height of the pandemic. we felt it was very important to in addition to all the polling that we do of the public and k-12 school parents and teachers, we wanted to get a better understanding of where teenagers were and how they were adapting during the pandemic. and then really commit to longer-term syria's so we can

see any changes over time -- commit to longer-term areas so we can see any changes over time. it was a better idea to get information about students and help them towards their future careers and also to see to what degree they feel their schooling experiences have been positive or negative and if there are any questions we can ask in order to better say, what can be done to help increase the positive experiences they are having in school and in learning, and also how to mitigate or address some of the negative areas that we have seen in our polling. host: when you quote results of your poll.

78% most or all classmates are bored. 19% say most classmates want to be in school, only 19%. guest: those are the negative findings i think we can all come together and feel that we need to do better for students and to provide them the best learning experiences in high school and even in the late middle school as well so that they can thrive and learn and be well educated. those are some findings that concern us. my colleagues have it written about this in the last couple of weeks after we released a poll. other surveys have found some

negatives. it is not that surprising. we were all teenage at one time and had gone to middle school and high school and had a range of experiences. those levels seem particularly high. that is on the one side. it wasn't all negative and the most recent polling. we had some broader views and good news that teens and average appeared to be happier than they were at the start of the school year. so some broad indicators, social, emotional, self advocacy, types of questions and they appear to be more positive than they were the last time we surveyed it teens back at the beginning of the school year. so that is some positive and good news in the survey but yes,

there are some things that are definitely concerning we should all be thinking about in terms of how we can improve the educational experiences of teens. host: that is the conversation we want to have with viewers, improving the educational experience for teens. parents and students dial in at (202) 748-8000, educators (202) 748-8001, all others (202) 748-8002. you can text at >> "washington journal" continues. -- at (202) 748-8003. you sound -- found 78% use social media and 40% said it had an negative impact on their mental health. is there a link between the

negative numbers you sought and social media? guest: the polling we do in the survey we cannot make that direct link and causal link there. we can infer and i think the descriptive numbers you cited are concerning and to the degree that it is impacting the mental and physical health of teenagers and we have seen this, the pew research center looked at some of these questions around the teenagers use of social media and cell phones and the questions and topics were different but the holistic

picture raises red flags in terms of where teenagers and how they feel about social media, cell phones. also in the schools. they have different ideas about an average view, access to social media and cell phones differently. one question we asked was what is the earliest age someone, a child, that should have access to cell phones or to social media and the teens in our survey were much more likely to say that children can be a little younger to have a cell phone or smartphone, but the vast majority said a student or child should be 13 years old or older to be able to access social media. there is even some recognition on teens' part on the effects

that it can be having on children. host: what about absteeism, 13% said they have already missed 15 plus days of school. this meets the definition of chronic absenteeism. the highest is for female students, 16%. lgbtq students 18%. what do you make of those numbers and why? guest: this is, consistent with other research that has been done in different ways and methods and looking at chronic absenteeism which has been in the headlines and something that has been just being discussed and considered in school districts of all types around the country.

that 13% number, one thing to consider is the survey was conducted at the end of february and early march, three quarters of the way through the school year and we already had 13% of teenagers self reporting 15 plus days of absences. with a few more months to go you would expect that 13% to be higher at the end of the school year. we also asked them how they see their closest friends and classmates and what proportion of those classmates are missing 15 plus days and it is a higher number. their perception is their peers are missing school being more frequently absent at higher rates so it is 19%. the numbers are a little bit down since our last and when you

compare not only when teens say themselves in self-report for themselves and what they observes of classmates and friends, but we asked a similar question to parents and our monthly tracking poll and we asked parents if they had a child with 15 or more absences and roughly at the same time we were surveying teenagers and only 3% of parents reported the absences. we are seeing a difference in what parents and teenagers report. we fielded a survey of teachers that we will be reporting out in a couple of weeks and asked what they are seeing in the classroom and how their students are and

it will be interesting to see what their observations and perceptions are of absenteeism because this issue is not going away. it was an issue and a challenge for school leaders and policymakers before the pandemic but when it hit, it exacerbated the problem. even though others have reported chronic absenteeism has gone down a bit since the peak in 2022, but levels currently are still higher than they were before the pandemic. this is an issue that won't be going away and something we will continue to ask. host: they looked at the results of the survey when they asked teens why there was this ch absenteeism and 64% of teens surveyed said school isorg including 69% of black teens, 59% say all of their student use

cell phones in class. some said if you are none of the classmates want to be in school. robert in new york, welcome to the conversation. caller: my question is how do you purse out on your statistics boredom of previous generations? i graduated 51 years ago and our classes were boring also. but we had the hope in the future and our parents would say, this is your job, you go to school and you have to learn and you are going. that is it and nothing else was accepted. how do you purse that out and how do we bring that hope back into the families and children to say it yes, your life will be better with education than without it? guest: that is a great question.

thank you for that question. i think it is someone who definitely appreciates and values, history and thinking about prior generations and their experiences. we don't have that data about what teenagers have felt about schooling and education in previous generations and that is beyond the scope of our project. but i think what you say has validity in terms of kids who have said they have been board at least anecdotally and what research has shown attitudes have persisted for a long time. we don't know, these levels right now are so high and i think it does signal and we

picked it up in questions we ask, what can we do to really change? schooling has not changed -- the way the classroom looks but we have technology we didn't have 20 or 30 or 50 years ago but in terms of how we are educating students is very similar to what it was back in the 1950's, 1960's, 19 70's in terms of the classroom structure and expectations for being in school five days a week and :00 until 3:00. those kinds of -- 8:00 until 3:00. those structures have been in place for ears and the pandemic disrupted that when remote schooling which a lot of people feel had negative impacts on student learning but there have been some positives in terms of more flexibility coming to families the last few years. our organization has been

tracking new educational choice programs, school savings, -- programs, vouchers, tax funded accounts have been growing and expanding to the point where we now have 11 school choice programs around the country that are universal or near universal for all students in the state. most recently alabama passed and enacted a new law that allows for program for students to have much more mobility and choice to public and private options. just yesterday in georgia, a new program enacted that expanded options for students in the state in low performing schools. we see a lot of energy and momentum to increase flexibility and not just in terms of where

students are going to school but also how they are learning. we have seen a hybrid schooling take off in recent years and micro schools taking off in recent years that are very different in terms of organization, structure and the way they provide an educational and learning experience. it will be interesting to see how that continues moving ahead in the future. host: what school choices will remedy these negative numbers? guest: our organization, we do every year put together a review of various types of outcomes on student learning, the academic outcomes for public school students and not only the

participating school choice students and we see on balance there is positive effects, sometimes slightly positive, for some groups of students if not all groups of students. we have seen that school choice programs on balance provide a positive effect on student learning on those public schools and school districts that are feeling competition now because students can move more freely between public and private schooling options. most recently there was a great study, very well done study and rigorous analysis looking at outcomes and how do private schools contribute to civic learning and civic outcomes such as volunteerism, voting and those kinds of activities that

we think of as democratic values. private schools were in some cases doing a better job than public schools in terms of instilling those democratic values in civic and leading civic types of outcomes. so there is a body of research looking at the academic outcomes, civic outcomes so forth that is well documented. host: let's go to bonnie in sioux center iowa, and educator. caller: i would like to make three observations about education and how it has changed since i was a student. the first change would be, there's more stressors that come from the school environment itself. i was a student in two states and have taught in three states, wisconsin, florida, and

california, and now i am a substitute teacher in iowa which is where i grew up. when i stopped in florida, the fear and the actuality of school students are stressors. the school from which i graduated where i sub now recently had an active shooter drill. that was something that never would have occurred to us in the 1960's and 1970's. the real or possible threat of violence is very traumatic. the second thing that is a big change, i would like to know how many of people who are of my generation can rattle off the names of multiple substitute teachers. i love substitute teaching but the fact is not only our students donned a lot more, so our teachers. that expectation that my teacher will be there because it is

their job, that has changed. there are excellent teachers but there is a mentality that i am entitled to my 10 days off. that was certainly not true when i was growing up. i don't know if that affects the student's perceptions of whether they want to be in school but it is a reality. a third change is family structure. i think that is the biggest factor. i just had another student tell me, and again student i see it rarely because i sub, that his peers are getting a divorce and that is so common in our society today. when i look back at my schooling, i really knew of almost no homes that weren't intact with a mother and father living in the home. i think the impact of that on our children in every area, including education, is huge. host: ok.

paul diperna? guest: a couple things i might add. those were good points. the point about teachers and how they are that something we haven't looked at and we could look at more is the nature of how teachers are in school and what are the constraints on them and how that may also than pass on and be constraints on the students in classrooms. i think there is increasing discussion about the inflexibility of the teaching profession because of different expectations and rules and regulations that are coming from different whether it from the school district or the state or even at the federal level.

i think this is an area that can be looked at a lot more and something we are planning to do some more survey research of teachers. also coming out of the pandemic in terms of being able considering the challenges they may have in maintaining the profession. we ask about teachers are likely to look for another profession or career and that number has been stable the last couple of years but seems to me it is pretty high, about half that they would think about another career. i think indirectly that can impact students in terms of the kinds of education they are

receiving. on the violence, perceptions and fears of violence in schools, we do ask the question in our surveys about if they are concerned about a violent intruder or mass intruder entering school and teenagers are less concerned than parents are about that. it has been a counterintuitive finding that refined find, less than one third of teens are extremely or very concerned about violence, that kind of violence of an intruder entering a school, where half of parents are concerned about that. then we ask other questions about bullying and teens tell us they are not, it doesn't seem they feel the schools are doing a good job addressing bullying in their schools and only one

third really say their school is doing a very good job. that has been an issue for years and generations. but i think there might be some more urgency right now among the other challenges that teens are facing today and adjusting in this post-pandemic world that we live in. host: dave in canton, ohio. caller: i was wondering if you asked the kids about how they like the school food. guest: that's a good question. we did not ask that. i can tell you anecdotally i have a 14-year-old and 11-year-old both in middle school right now and they actually sometimes say the schools are doing a better job than their dad making lunches.

anecdotally, that seems to be a step in the right direction. that is it a good idea and that is something we could look into because i think nutrition, and there are others that do research or on the importance of nutrition for student learning and that is a good idea and i appreciate your question. host: steve in fairfax county, virginia, what isouview on allowing phones and why it is no phone in the classroom not the default or is it? guest: so it is case-by-case. that is a very good question. i have my own opinion on this but i think that what we see and what we do ask in surveys whether teenagers, parents, if they feel cell phones it should be allowed in the classroom or allowed in school were generally

and i don't think it is to anyone surprised that the teens feel they should be allowed to have phones in the classroom or school at much higher rates than what parents think. we will soon find out when we release the new teachers poll and we will see how teachers feel in my hunch is teachers will feel less conducive and agreeable to having cell phones at least in the classroom. so there is a disconnect between parents and teens in terms of allowing them in the classroom or in school. host: deborah is in odessa, florida. caller: i have a question. we have a program in our area that serves some of the schools like pack asap program -- pack a

sack for them to take home. i want to say is do you do any research or do you know anything about how many of the children that are going to school are actually homeless, that their families are living in cars and not getting a well rested night sleep or even proper nutrition and what are we doing about it? guest: that is an excellent question and we do not ask them specifically in our surveys about their home environment to that detail. so that is a very good question and something we will certainly

be considering. we have a certain amount of space on the questionnaires that we use for our surveys and a certain amount of background information and questions we can ask, especially for teenagers. but that is a really good idea and something that we will definitely consider. host: barber in garland, texas, and educator. what do you teach? caller: i did teach and just retired after 23 years, middle school. host: go ahead with your comment or question. caller: one thing i continually see is it seems that kids are getting free lunch and they turn around and have 150 dollars sneakers on and a cell phone that i cannot afford.

we seem to be doing a lot of free giveaways of free lunch. i want to feed the kids, but when they say everybody in the school gets free lunch, it seems to be we are not using our funds in a way that is appropriate or helpful. so i would like to see a comment on that. host: we will have paul respond. guest: in our survey we don't ask about those questions around those and how they spend their own money or parents money. i think the free lunch point that you made and that was a big consideration and a major initiative especially early on during the pandemic and to be

honest, i haven't kept up with for the policy has been going more recently. but that is something we can ask more and go back to the earlier comment about nutrition. i think they are potentially good questions we can ask about the importance around the home environment to the other calle s 's question about homelessness, nutrition and well-being. we do have some questions around well-being but not the specifics of sleep habits or buying habits or those types of things. those are good questions for us and i think there are researchers that could take that on. host: casey in silver spring, maryland, also an educator. caller: i just wanted to ask if

you ever had a chance to correlate the attitude or i guess overall positive attitude of students in the classroom when in the classroom the cell phones are allowed versus not allowed and then also further within that analysis if there could be any correlation between how the attitude of the students and how they might feel in a question that allows cell phones to be used versus a student that doesn't use a classroom doesn't use a cell phone in the classroom. host: we will take that. paul diperna guest: we have not done that

type of correlation or analysis. it so much of the reporting we do is descriptive and we just ask readers to take it at face value in reporting the numbers. i think it is a really good question. i do know that when pew research center released their thorough report a couple months ago looking at teens and parents attitudes around specifically social media and cell phones, they found around a seven out of 10 teenagers actually felt peaceful when they don't have their smart phone. i think you can draw something from that. around 45% said not having a smart phone them feel anxious so you can indirectly come to

conclusions on what that does in the classroom setting if they are not allowed to have their smart phone but close to half of teens could potentially be feeling anxious and what does that do to disruptions in the classroom overall for that teacher to handle that with 20 to 25 students. really good questions and it is something we could look into more and we welcome that kind of feedback and the ideas for different secondary analyses of the data. host: eva, a parent. caller: i am a grandmother, a great great grandmother. what bothers me is they cannot read cursive and cannot read

anything that is written in cursive. why had the schools stopped teaching cursive writing? i would love to see my children and great-grandchildren learn to read what i write but our forefathers wrote. host: paul diperna? guest: i am not knowledge about policies around cursive and so i hesitate to say anything. i know there is a researcher at usc that looked at this around cursive and what it can mean. he is a researcher at usc and that is maybe some went to google and learn more about his research. i am just vaguely familiar with initiatives and legislatures around the country to introduce

or bring back cursive for second graders and third-graders but i don't know much more beyond that. host: one of our viewers mentioned that tennessee passed a law that allows teachers to carry guns at school. how do students feel about that? guest: we did not ask that question to students. we have asked that question in the past to parents and teachers. we found that teachers roughly 20 percent to 25% of teachers are ok with it but the vast majority would not support that type of policy. we haven't asked that question in at least a year or so. and then parents, by contrast, are more likely to support that type of policy, close to 55% to 60% at some level somewhat support and there are

differences between parent and teacher attitudes around that kind of policy. that was a surprise finding as a parent for me when we learned that. that is something and we would try to stay responsive to news developments and policy developments and that is likely to be a question we will bring back and ask about. host: paul diperna is the vice president at edchoice.