community. community. host: what happened there? guest: a group of professionals, doctors,unt

with respect to the black community because this is a period during which the ideology of supremacy was supreme. owning homes and driving cars and wearing beautiful clothesnaf some folks in tulsa. and people are familiar with the k.k.k. and had an enormous presence. that was a factor. addo the mix the media and in called the one local media an u tribune and we had a powder keg in tulsa to ignite the racial

violence that occurred on may 31 and june 1. host: you mentioned the newspaper. a feature, state history. you one of the notables who worked on researching and on the tulsa]& massacre. and brought new attention to a subject long ignored with over 100 people deadnd 1,000 buildings destroyed. how does something like that get to be? guest: it is ignored as a deliberate decision on the part of people who are in power and occupy positions of privilege.

host: wh did you the term massacre race. guest: when the incident■: occurred, and referred to as race riots. and in the last 10 years or so, there was a movement, particularly in the black community to take charge offf nomenclature to be a better descriptive from riot to mass about what other terms. and i tell people that critical thinkinglm around this is important to me. not what you settle on but you understand that different words

different meanings and naming something is an important element of claiming that event. "black wall street 100". historical racial trauma. and he is with us this 10:00 a.k focusing on black history month. and join the conversation. and if you are -- w3

>> right now. my brother we livs history and we can't ignore it. our lives we lost everything that day, our homes,

churches, our newspapers, our theaters, our lives, greenwood represented all the best that was possible for black in america and for all the people. no one cared about us for almost 100 history have been forgotten, warkd away. this congress must recognize us in ourmerica, for the white americans and for all americansy of 2021. what did that testimony represent? and what was mrs. that day? guest: it is listening to them. and unfortunately, we now have the blackwhich

includes voices of many of the individuals who were alive during the period of the that gave testimony to a state con veepped commission from 1997 to 2001 and their testimony was recorded. so we used some of their testimony in presenting information about the massacre in■) t context. those voices are important to hear, to help us understwh transpired and how how it affected real people during those events. host: she was going to release a memoir on her experiences, has she done it yet? guest: yes, she has and i have talked to number of survivors

back when there were more than 100 survivors living and talking to them, what i discovered from them was what they wanted more than anything else ishave their story told, to make sure that people understood what happened to them in part so thas again. host: who is ellis. guest: one of the three individuals who has a suit against the city and others that is on appeal right now. he is deceased right now and died within the last two, three months. >> and talking about the tulsa race massacre. phone lines if you want to join

the conversation. several books on this topic with us here on ""washington journal"."

she said she remembers and i'm 53 years old now and she said to me that she remembers when white men dragged a black man through the streets behind cart. i was six years old. but i have to get people to understand that these older people who went through and saw all these tragic things that she talked about black people being tarred and feathered, hung and burned and people don't get it or don't understand it. and these such tragic things. and i believe that my great-grandmother was getting me this reality that black people live even today. and that's all i have■l to say.

and if people don't understand it and don't understand we need conversation that these people . they lost livelihoods, they lost generational wealth. it is absolutely -- it angers me to the point of what is america doing. guest: han ball johnson. guest: one point is that teaching our real history, a people's history in the united states is imperative. we can't possible apply understand why we have the racial dynamic we have today. we don't understand our history. and another point is about the legacy of these horrific like ts

in which the massacre occurred in tulsa in 1921. ful we acknowledge and validate and leverage the shared humanity that exists in each and every one of us. host: you mentioned a people history. and the famous book 1492 to

present came out in 2009. what is a peoples' history? >> it is a recognition that there are multiple narratives and multiple dimensions of our history. history is not simply the dominant culture version of events. involves the multi policity of voices and most aic of different experiences and if we can understand that and make sure that approach is the way that we■z cstruct our curriculum, we are going to be better off having known the stories, the various strands of our history. host: this is jim, good morning. caller: thank you, you have had

great guests. one of the things that mr. woodsonem■earked on was the black-on-black homicide taking in one year as many■es as 50 years of pre civil rights. so i'm curious that keeping -- do you think that the condition of black communities where there is a highlight of black-on-black homicide, do you think that is linked in any way in tulsa. i don't know how often recent history, that kind of event

repeated. if you were to write the history on black-on black homicide rate, tell me what you would highlight, thank you. guest: i don't think think in terms of plaque-on-black crime. and specifically, i think you ntione homicide. homicide usually is a crime that involves people in close proximity to one another, people who know one another and talk about white-on-white crime or

hispanic-on-hispanic crime, because it is r and approximate kind of occurrence. i think one of the other things that you raise is this idea that psychologists will call internalized oppression. one of the things that are raised, sometimes oppressed people take on self-evaluation that comes on in society. if you are a personu+ who devaln violence against people who are like you. and that is a psychological dynamic that happens in a society in which race relations

host: this idea of a forgotten tragedy, forgotten massacre and forgotten at a time, were from others forgotten massacres on the level of tulsa that happened in the united states? guest: there are a number of historical racial tragedi thaitd states. in 1919, elaine, arkansas, longview, texas, outbreak in new york, baltimore, washington, d.c., memphis, more than 24 major so-called race riots in america 1919. an listeners are

unaware of those occurrencees one of the callers referred to a horrific lynching that she was told about. this violence on african-americans, these were often hangings, sometimes burning,■ding cast traitions, these were public spectacles and children often witnessed this violence. one of the lynchings occurred here in oklahoma in 1911 and lynch lady named laura nelson and her son in oklahoma. they were lynched from a bridge, po c lynching.

children witnessed the lynching including a very youngood yes guthrie. host: what did they do with post cards? guest: they were sent to friends and relatives around the country. acknowledging, celebrating t fact that the sender had borne guest: good morning in atlanta, georgia. caller: happy month and thank you for being with us today. i have a question to ask you today and i'm dloipted and talk about plaque homicide because you usually tell people to stick to the topic and that isn't definitely the topic, the topic

is about tulsa and race mr. johnson, there is the rosewood incident and for people who don't know about that. post cards, there were post cards of the tulsa incident that were also sent. i want to know if there was any investigation done by the bureau of investigation, the federal before it became the f.b.i. and isk because i recently watched the movie, killers of the flower moon and that occurred around the same time of tulsa race riots and investigated the killing of native americans and any investigation done by them in tulsa.

this is a cause for reparations. thank yh. there are documentaries where you can see the footage of the riots and see there flying over dropping cans i don't know if it was gasoline or kerr seen■d a was absolutely awful and these footages are on youtube. and please and see this is this is documented about what what happened and it was atrocious. thank you very much and have a nice day. guest: i don't know of any investigation by the f.b.i. the mosth investigation came years later with the convening of what is called the oklahoma commission to study tulsa race riot of 1921.

economic development incenve rek community and some sort of

substantial monument or memorial. those are the typesl8 of reparations recommended. guest: what came about? never ax payments made. there were a establishment of the scholarship fund and was broadend and in member and in tribute to the master but not limited to the descend ants of the massacre and they set up in the greenwood district, but that body was not funded and nothing really came of that. and the state did invest 2 million in a public park in tulsa that memorializees the massacre and survivors and the

history surrounding the massacre. host: this is howard, good morning, you are next. >> good morningrother johnson and i appreciate the truth of what is happening in america. you know there was inprescription in the bible and not deficient eat but inprescription and there was ant black-on-black, i'm not going to diverse from it, but i would like him to know that my young black brothers and they are getting guns like candy and there is no black manufacturer of guns in america and can only lead to one person that are distributing these guns. but this is my question. i know donald thrump went to

tulsa a few years back and brought recognition to the topic of what is happening today about tulsa. and you know that came january 6, that same act went upon our country. state called it a riot but really an nerks, it was a coupe togovernment to establish their own government. i would like to know if there is corelation in history and answer his question as well because it was done the same way. guest: one of the interesting things about the massacre in tulsa, law enforcement auorities in tulsa departmentized some of the white men in the mob that destroyed

the greenwood community. so that kind of official sanction of the violence really resonates gen the snarks -- insurrection on january 6. is mark from tulsa, oklahoma. >> this is mark coming from tulsa, oklahoma. double digits now.

i think most people in tulsa, they are not racist. i mean, we all of race and some sort of spade. but we know the differences is the love and to be better and the more we conct with each other and better off we are. and i feel our media makes us hate each other. you people wanting to bring their love to this country and they know these people are great and assimilate and we are treating them like

secondary people and don't have a u.s.a. citizenship and de racist and murderers and bringing in fentanyl. a if the demand is there. but what i want to go to is the history of what happened. i read a little bit about greenr keith, the church therehe the b. really nice man -- this is my question. what mapped. what really happened? everybody loved him and shoe shining and white people loved him and get caught in theissingi

was told they got off and gotbút married. guest: it's important to go back to the context for the violence in tulsa in 1921 and to remember what was america like in 1921. it was a really often violent period. difficult time to and just the so-called race riots but the lynching. you have a successful black community here in tulsa in a place in the united states where the pri vailing ideology is white supremacy and jealousy and envy with respect