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the gatekeeper, the publisher, the second week of donald trump's trial was all about the witnesses who can put the former president at the very center part of a criminal conspiracy to defraud the american people. >> good evening. i'm abby phillip and you're watching a special edition of newsnight and i'm laura coates and washington dc. and today, i mean, really redefining what water cooler talk really means. we're on a graph the longtime trump secretary took to the stand and she did it by the way, not by choice. she was there under subpoena and she added small but critical details. the prosecution's case remember, she was the one who entered contact details for stormy daniels for karen mcdougal into the trump organization directory. she told the jury the adult film actress who's silenced, tried to buy allegedly was simply labeled, well, what else stormy with her cell phone number filled in graphs said that she saw daniels on floor 26 of trump tower. that's where the office chatter, of course,

comes in. graph thought that she wasn't contention perhaps to appear as a contestant on the apprentice. >> now the day closed with the least name-brand witness, somebody who probably would be anonymous to most americans, even those most familiar with the details of this case against the former president, meet gary pharaoh. he is michael cohen's former banker. he worked at first republic and if that bank sounds vaguely familiar to you, is because it crashed and burned last year. pharaoh was the one who put the rubber stamp on a brand new shell company for cohen resolution consultants. that was the company that the fixer used to pay the porn star. let's bring in our panel. we have jid rosie here, former federal prosecutor, former trump attorney tim parlatore, allele. it will williams, a former deputy assistant attorney general, and marcus childress farmer, january 6, investigative counsel. everyone, thanks for being here. so first of all trump keeps complaining about this courthouse. is really that gold. i've been i've tried

several cases in that courthouse it was hard when i was there, but i think they've done some renovations so i guess the answer is no. >> it is a dingy 19, i think 60s or 70s style bonfire of the vanities might be the best way to describe the courthouse. that probably hasn't undergone the kind of renovations that you think it's part of the charm, elliott, i know you also have some details from this day in the courthouse what did we learn? so a day of trial looks like this. >> it's i mean, there's actually quite a lot more than the last know. it doesn't a lot more than the last couple of days. and its, and its done since it today, wasn't adept hey of major bombshell testimony, but there were some very interesting both human moments because this all deals with sex, money, and allegations of lies. and so we can talk through some of the most compelling that's a testimony here. interestingly, there was cross-examination were stormy, where the purpose

of stormi daniels came up and this whole question of why did the trump organization have her name and her phone number? and this was on cross-examination because the emanation from susan necklace the defense attorney, we can even read the portions of the transcript. they come up here nicholas asks, am i correct that prior to stormy daniels coming up to the office at trump tower, you recall hearing the president trump discussed whether stormy daniels would be a good contestant on the apprentice and graph says, i vaguely recall hearing him say that he was one of the people that she was one of the people that may be an interesting contestant on the show necklace says, okay, so the prosecutor just referred to her, i think as a quote adult film actress, correct? a bro-nah. graph. trump's assistant says, yes, nicholas. and you understood that to mean that she was colloquially speaking a porn star, right? rhona graff says, i'd say

that's a good synonym now, there's a few things happening here too, and more than anything else they want to establish even if there were these allegations of misconduct with the former president he had a reason for having her at trump tower, stormy daniels at trump tower ridges that he was betting her for a possible position on the celebrity apprentice. >> so this was on cross-examination. this was the purpose really to cast doubt on whether this affair you're actually happened, whether it actually happened or not, the simple fact is she had a reason for being in their records and there can i just say something yeah. in any trial, you should under promise and over-perform in your opening under promise. >> and one of the achilles heels of the defense is basically saying these relationships did not happen. i respectfully disagree. i think this witness was outstanding and that is a bombshell because trump has said, i don't even know stormy daniels, let alone

having a relationship. and that is going to hurt them in front of the jury because they owe over promised at the same time though, think about this. >> they don't really have to prove that the allegations of an affair or any interaction. so we say is true, right? this is about falsifying business records and the premise of the prosecution's cases the allegation and the news being out there was so problematic for this team, the campaign that they wanted to shut it down. and so having it out there, that that was the reason that he wanted to silence or buyer sounds is really doesn't matter if it actually happened, right? but the problem though with this, and i can tell you on the direct and we were talking about is what was actually going on was at the time we all said hold on a second. why is trying to be daniel's in a directory? i have this is a very transactional one time relationship of sorts, not at not a karen mcdougal scenario. it was a one time thing and she's she's a part of the directory they want. meanwhile,

karen mcdougal also there with two addresses, email address, telephone numbers, as well. that was pretty stunning in that moment that she's part of the directory. can i offer one possible explanation and tim, maybe you have some insights into this. >> donald trump typically uses other people to get in touch with who he wants to talk to you. he is a very old school guy until recently. hadn't really used. he didn't really text people. he didn't really use a cell phone in that way. he would say to hope hicks hope call x, y, and z. so to me, that is the reason now, i mean that the jury might need to understand that, but that would be the reason that's absolutely true. i mean, a good portion of my relationship with him, i would get calls from other people saying please hold for donald trump, please hold for the president. and so it does make sense. you want to explain why these people are in there, but his point it doesn't matter whether any of these fairs happened or not. all that matters is that there is a

story that they don't want to be out there. and whether it's true or not, they want to kill. i mean, it's the same thing with the doorman's story, whether it's true or not or whether ted cruz's fathers involved in the kennedy assassination all of these stories, whether they're true or not, is irrelevant to the fact there's the documentary evidence i came in today. i found to be it's not what we're talking about right now, but i think it's gonna be incredibly important during closings we all know we've all done closing arguments that we the secretary today that we were able to get or the prosecution i'm not on this team anymore, but we all right forever we've got to us have been what what documentary evidence do you think oh, i'll just use the michael cohen, the shell company documents today. >> that's going to be critical in the timeline going back to when the news broke of stormy daniels, now you have a marker. now you have a marker of when michael cohen was michael cohen was able to create this shell company. and you can walk the jury through a timeline and you can just lay those documents. you can go to the direct testimony. you can reference the cross-examination, and that's not sexy right now, but

i guarantee you in four to five weeks, it will be when you're given that closer i want to supplement what you said the timeline will be crucial in you're right. >> but according to it and read the transcript by red somebody writing about it. but according to the testimony, michael cohen called the banker and said, i really, really, really need to set this bank account up. in that corroborates his testimony when he's going to say by october 28, we were desperate to get this deal done because we were scared to death that could decide the election. and also collaborates david pecker, right? go back to how we for sure everything is about repetition right? and primacy and recency. thinking about what are the your marks have things that a song and it gets in your ear a great sermon, a great speech. it's all about repetition. and so the more you hear it, the more it goes into the brain of the jurors that you believe it. so david pecker this episode is already and

said, listen, i wasn't paying for this. i didn't want to do that. but he also wanted to have a shell company wanted to have i don't want a direct line between the trump organization in me. i ultimately rep. if his contract, all that stuff. now the jury is thinking, oh, wait, you know what i've heard this before. now it rings true to me. you know, what's another bit of repetition you're going to keep hearing and you heard today on that debt that i told you the words, porn star, and it is in the interest of the defense. >> keep reminding the jury about what the jobs are of these people, what they are doing and seeking to do subliminally or, or maybe even explicitly, is dirty up the witnesses and make these folks who are coming in to testify because there is someone on that jury who is going to have a problem with the fact that you're talking about infidelity adult film ways feel like that's as much a problem for donald trump. on the infidelity part, but on the porn star park zoo, a credibility point absolutely to elliot. i know you have a little bit. give us give us a little bit more from the testimony today. so when judging thing is about the

incentives of ami, this company why they behave the way they did and frankly acted the way they did against their own financial interests to benefit donald trump's campaign. and there was a really interesting exchange on the direct examination from the prosecutor, joshua steinglass. so we can go through right here. and so steinglass asks david pecker again, this is the head or the publisher of ami, the company. did you say or did ami say? in this document that amis principal purpose in entering into the agreement was to suppress the model story so as to prevent it from influencing the election. pecker sets? that is correct is that true, mr. pecker was that your purpose and locking up the karen mcdougal story to influence the election. this is laura's point about repetition. again he says pecker says, yes. so cyclists, if i understand you correctly, running stories that praise mr. trump appealed to your readership. packers says yes, they did what they were doing here was suppressing these stories that appeal to the rigueur ship in a way that later on in this, he does say this was actually against our

interest because we could have made a ton of money on this story but chose not to because it was in our interest to help out donald. >> how does that play marcus? >> well, i think it plays well, honestly, for the for the government's case, when we go to the reputation of, your going through these themes like instead of being the national enquirer where i'm going to post these trump stories. i'm going to keep it because i wanted to win the election and that's really important for proven up in the misdemeanor to the felony sayyed this false business records claims, and i don't know. i've heard a lot of commentators say that they don't think that the campaign part is a strong, i don't know. we're only three witnesses and i feel like it's already becoming a theme that we're talking about tone. so i'm not sure. i think there were any moments swear that you felt like the defense really did a good job puncturing the prosecutors arguments here here's the thing. >> all of the themes that we're talking about and the repetition a good defense is going to sit there and say all of that is undisputed. the all of these things about what am i did. but that doesn't have

anything to do with the actual crime and one thing that it makes an effective defense is to separate out there the things that are not in dispute that they're going to waste just weeks of your time proving and re proving and reprove things that we don't dispute you can ignore all that because the only key is what happened here with these documents. and that's the only part that's in dispute and that's also the only part that there's no corroboration for what michael cohen said once they one thing that this can be proven on the papers though this is just falsification of business records, but he can't because it has to go to what's the intent? of the fossil vacation. and what crime was that done in furtherance up. and so, so far, what you have is you have a lot of transactions that again, are not in dispute. i mean, they're all on paper. you can't dispute these things but you can dispute whether the actual payment to stormy daniels, the way that it was paid back to michael cohen. and what donald trump knew about that and what that purpose was of putting the entry is charged with

misdemeanor would be over already getting that felony. is that is directly everyone? >> that's a lot more setup lawyers. good luck said something. >> i said yesterday, it's like holding back the tsunami. everyone standby for us, breaking tonight as well. donald trump's former attorney general, bill barr, telling cnn in a blockbuster interview that americans are sympathizing with trump during his trials. plus why he says that he'll still vote for trump, even though trump shouldn't be anywhere near the oval office. and the story that god, america talking tonight, involving one of trump's running mate content tenders by kristi noem admits she killed her puppet cnn news night with adam please he is brought to you by. >> so tick to find out if so tick two is the treatment you've been looking for. >> you found it, the feeling of binding he psoriasis can't filter out the real you. so go ahead, live unfiltered with the

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happened with jesse l. >> martin sunday at nine on cnn well, this just to cnn, former attorney general bill barr speaking in the last hour, cnn's kaitlan collins. >> here's what he said when asked to be clear about voting for donald trump are many previously said, if you can recall, he could not support just to be clear, you're voting for someone who you believe tried to subvert the peaceful transfer of power that can even achieve his own policies that lied about the election, even after his attorney general told him that the election wasn't stolen and as the former chief law enforcement in this country, you're going to vote for someone who is facing 88 criminal counts luck. >> the ada criminal counts. a lot of those are ten of them are accurate he answered the question is yes. i'm supporting i'm supporting the republican

ticket. >> can you say that donald trump because you're not saying his name, you just say you're supporting the republican ticket. >> i've said as between biden and trump, i will vote for trump because i believe he will do less damage over the four years. >> well, our panel is back and also joining us is republican adviser arena shot and former hillary clinton spokesperson philip ryan's. >> i had to tell you i had to pause and just figure out where the yes was. >> i knew it was coming in the nasser was in fact, there were you surprised to think that after all is said and done, he is saying, look, yes, when given the choice between trump and biden even in spite of all the kaitlan just listed notice the only talked about the last but not the policies. anything else that that would be the choice i'm not surprised. >> this is this is a moment in which people are carrying forth like this is politics as usual. >> this is a man who's been taken an oath for upholding the law. >> hizon, see black and white here. what is gray for you? bill barr, what is stopping you

from saying? okay, you know what? i'm a little bit more worried about my bank account here. he can't say it. he can't admit the truth. they'll never tell the truth. those republicans that are so worried about democrat policies that are road the country are actually not worried about the social policies. they are worried about the fiscal because democrats want to give all our money way that's what's been ingrained in the republican mine when i was a young staffer on the hill that was a talking point. democrats want to take your money. they went to erode the american way for generations to come. and there's no reversing it unless you vote for the person within our next or their name. very simple. and that's what i heard right there. so for democrats though, they're working against, if they're, if, their plan as we're going to appeal to the thought that you couldn't possibly both for someone we're going to clutch the pearls, whether it's, whether it's the idea of an access hollywood tape or the idea of now the 88 plus convictions or sorry, indictments and charges if that's the game plan. and bill barr of all people is saying,

okay, well, and what's next? how will it works. and usually for democrats, well, i don't know. i mean, i think if you showed that video 225 million independence democrats, republicans, you weren't sure that's hardly selling i don't trump i mean, i'm not surprised that bill barr would walk into the voting booth and cast a ballot for donald trump. >> i'm surprised that he feels that there was something in it for him to go on cnn and have that conversation because frankly for such a smart guy, he looked like an idiot and why would you put yourself in a situation? he actually makes an incredibly good case. why you should vote for joe biden because he couldn't even the most important part are the most interesting part of this that he concedes that at least ten of the counts are actually valid. so whereas his usual routine which he did with bob mueller during the mother

investigation was saying, well, you know what? i don't like donald trump a whole lot, but you know what this was, a witch-hunt and i'm going to stand up for what's right and the rule of law. but here, he just admitted that. yeah. there's 88 of them. a lot of a metal agree with. he just said ten of them are pretty valid by caitlin. >> i think offer whether if even if ten, would that be enough and she said he said, well, the answer, the question, zero. yes. i heard you, but we really bad this idea. you've caught carver-hawkeye, so well. >> the idea that the lesser of two evils that's what it comes down to. well, look, i mean, this is my especially for the democrats at the table who our many of you there are shouldn't this not be a wake-up call that there are probably millions of bill bars out there who don't like donald trump one bit, but we'll go into that ballot box and cast a vote for him. >> what i found most interesting about it, and not even a political point, there's a purely legal one and coming from bill barr, this idea of some of the charges being legitimate, being charged with a crime is enough for

people to judge you your conduct. it's not enough to send you to jail, but charges are sufficient. so here's a great example. if someone were charged with assaulting children, you would not hire them as a babysitter if someone was charged with arson, not convicted, you wouldn't hire them in a mcdonald's or whatever else. the idea that somehow someone needs to be convicted of a crime before you can make a reasonable reason judgment about them for the presidency is sort of silly. and the idea that a former attorney general is saying, well, there are legitimate charges against him, but i'm still going to vote for him is ludicrous, giving his roles a former law enforcement officer, there are all sorts of ways we judge people simply for being just save you he would say that it's the presumption of innocence for going to jail for a conviction not four. can you be the standard bearer for pulled elected i mean, i wonder, i wonder for you personally and i'd actually don't know your politics really but when you look at a bill barr, who is a law enforcement officer, he was

trump's attorney general. >> he was there for some of those moments when trump was literally trying to subvert the last election. what do you make of somebody with that kind of pedigree saying what he said today? >> i'm going to take some of your advice because as a lawyer, i always take the position of i'm happy to talk about whether somebody should go to jail or not, whether they should go the oval office is somebody else's discussion to have and so i think that he stepped outside of that, but i think that there's there are elements here where there are people who they may not vote for trump, they may vote against biden just like in 2020, there were probably a whole bunch of people who didn't vote for biden. they voted against trump. and that'll probably happen again this year. so but beyond that, i agree that certainly as a lawyer and law enforcement officers better to how about i call no, i want to find this, but how about this moment

though? but he's, he goes on, i thought this was a really interesting point it wasn't just that there was his own views, but he thinks that others to your point, there are other so-called bill barr is out there in the form of people who are sympathizing with trump based on the perception that it's a pylon. listen to what he says i think a lot of the country sympathizers with them. >> so i think the longer the trial goes on, the more support he gets why did you make of that? >> i think he's four bologna and i'm not going to use the word i used last night i am just going to that poll. i think you had it on yesterday they had a poll of people views on the hush money, election interference 34% thought it was too harsh. trump's been treated too harshly. but 34% thought he was being treated too leniently and then there was another category that was about about right. but if the

total up the one who who felt he was feeding, treated leniently plus the one who felt he was being just right. that was almost 60% when he says a lot of people, i don't know who he's talking to, but i want to add this elliott and i worked in the main justice building. it's a beautiful building on the fifth floor is ready. attorney general has his office. and when he was attorney general twice, when he walked out, elliott knows this in an extra number. tonga is a wonderful quote the united states wins. it's point when justice is done, its citizens in a court in i see that man right now, after all the things he's done, all the days he spent in that building. and he's basically saying, i'm going to vote for a criminal a criminal that shouldn't be in the white house. i'll vote for that person over joe biden. he's lost his mind. no gene jackson, be true, right those morals and values of the justice department, all the quotes that beautiful,

wonderful but people don't understand the legal system. >> people do not understand that there are multiple different jurisdictions independently of each other. investigating the president, i think a lot of america and this is what bill barr was talking about. a lot of americans actually think it's a pylon because a lot of americans it's actually think joe biden is the puppeteer pulling the strings in atlanta in new york, and san, according to this poll that i but point is, he is saying here that there's all these processes secretions happening and people think it's one big deep state pylon against the nation i will you're not going to get, get out from under that. i think what do you what do you think read about? i would say this. >> let's not forget the number of voters who the allegations are enough for them. i'm one of those voters the convictions or another for another set of voters, right? >> that's what it's simple to me as a non-legal person, as a non-legal professional, a person who does not deal with the law every day does not understand all the tears and what's all these 91 plus

indictments that always talked about and the only playbook the republicans ever have to go by is the weaponization of a system against a private system. >> it can happen to me or you like none and i don't look at all these allegations, isn't it something if my neighbor had all these allegations? >> against him or her, i would not let my kids go play over there. sorry. it just would not happen. >> what i underside though, i'm very notion because there were and this is very different scenarios. but of course you've worked for hillary clinton and the lock corrupt chance. we can all recall. and the me intimation. well, really the clear statement that was trying to be made by those who were saying it was the allegation not to be enough for people. james comey, jim comey came out in that infamous moment where he tried to usurp the role of the attorney general, the united states got out of pocket out of his lane and said, i think i'm gonna go in front of a camera and target whether someone hello, sorry. do i have an opinion? i'm sorry about that. but on that very point the allegations are enough. why is that? not okay for hillary

and appropriate for trump? >> there's no good answer to that, but i think you touched on something else which is that we're now two-and-a-half presidential cycles. into donald trump's lifespan. 2016. the truth is, is that he was still blustery and obnoxious, but he had message and he had an effective attack. i don't know if it was 50, 50, but whatever it was a right balance, any one 2020, he lost because that was out of whack. he really had no message. just a lot of noise, a lot of anger russia, whatever it was ms handling covid that noise killed him. if you look at what's happening now, it's noise times ten he's grievance all the time. there's no message. it's vengeance. >> these to me, these trials. yes. we can talk about which is most severe weather, people see them as one weather people see them as rigged or deepstate,

whether people understand them, whether they'll start, finish, we'll look, come to fruition, but their noise this idea that donald trump, that these trials help him sees the day and dominate, you know what, that's why he's going to lose because people don't want this noise. i think even people who don't mind him don't want this in their face every day. that seems to be why he lost in 2020 that enough people who voted for him in 2016 who weren't bothered by what he said, how he said it just don't want this extra layer of correct for it. >> i just think people in 2020, they wanted they wanted something new because he screwed up so bad, it's like, okay, let's take a chance on something new. and this time it's like, let's go back and see how that went with so much complete for memory loss of everything that went wrong during that administration. well, one of the things about the chaos is that it's pretty good reminder of what the trump era was actually like. >> i mean, it was kinda like

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that's not a typo. >> find the plan that's right for you et trust and whale.com, the white house correspondents dinner, live tomorrow at seven eastern on cnn here's a question tonight. did tim scott just become the vp favorite for donald trump? well that's because another contender, kristi noem, just ticked off quite a lot of americans. all right, let here's the backstory. south dakota governor is releasing a new book. >> you may have heard in the guardian got its hands on a copy and the outlet is now

flagging a section in which she describes killing her puppy, a puppy named cricket honestly the easiest way to describe this is just frankly to read the main part of the article to you. it says a cricket was a wire hair pointer about 14 months old. she says adding that the dog, a female, had an aggressive personality and needed to be trained to be used for hunting pheasant. now she includes her story about this illustrated cricket by the way, and she says to illustrate her willingness in politics as well as in south dakota life. apparently to do anything difficult, messy, and ugly if it simply needs to be done by taking cricket on a pheasant hot with older dogs. nham says, she hoped to calm the young dog down and begin to teach sure. >> how to behave now, unfortunately, cricket ruined the hunt. >> she says going quote, out of her mind with excitement, chasing all those birds and having the time of her life known describes calling cricket than using an electronic color

to attempt to bring her under control. nothing worked then on the way home after the hunt as noem stopped to talk to a local family, cricket escaped gnomes truck and then attacked that families, chickens quote, grabbing one chicken at a time, crunching it to death with one byte, then dropping it to attack another. >> now, cricket, the untreatable dog, noem rights behaves like a trained assassin. now, we're known finally grabbed cricket. she says the dog whipped around to bite me then as the chickens owner wept this is real everyone known repeatedly apologized, wrote the shocked family, and check quote for the price they asked and help them dispose of the carcasses, littering the scene of the crime? >> now through it all noem says the cricket was the picture of pure joy. i hated that dog noem rights, adding the cricket had proved herself quote, to be untreatable, dangerous to anyone that she came into contact with at less than

worthless as a hunting dog at that moment, noem says, i realized i had to put her down. no whilst represents her state in congress for eight years, got her gun, then lead cricket to a gravel pit finish. >> she writes it was not a pleasant job. she writes, but it had to be done. and after it was over, i realized another unpleasant job needed to be done. incredibly, the tail of slaughter is actually not finished at this point. her family, she writes, also owned a male goat. >> now, the male goat was nasty and mean because it had not been castrated furthermore, the goat smell, disgusting, musty, and rancid as i guess go okay. but that's another story because it loved to chase gnomes, children, knocking them down and ruining their clothes. >> so she so she decided this is risky israel, because she decided to kill the unnamed go the same way she had just killed cricket the dog.

>> but thought she dragged him to win. but those she dragged him to a gravel pit the goat jumped as she shot, and therefore survived the wound now the page turner, so no one says she went back to her truck retrieved another shell than quote hurried back to the gravel pit and put them down. now at that point, she writes, you realize a construction crew had watched her hill both animals and the startle workers, who they got back to work. she writes only for a school bus to arrive and drop-off gnomes, children. she writes, kennedy looked around confused, no rights or a daughter who asked hey, where's cricket? >> it's pretty awful as someone who lost a daughter, she wrote this in her child. honestly, it's really traumatic. and if you're thinking, wait, there's no way that this could possibly be true. well known defended the scenes in that book in a statement she says she loves animals, but tough decisions

happen all the time on a farm. in fact, she's it says they recently put down three horses. >> well, joining us now is dog trainers act george, host of zach, georgia's dog training revolution. >> and i have to say laura, before you bring zack in, my dog was partly trained by zach when he was a puppy he's a hunting dog as well. and they're tough. they're difficult. but they're great dogs. they can be trained welcome to the show's act. >> this is a special moment. thank you. >> i love that. well, listen, i know i appreciate them guides you don't like yeah. >> i'm glad you found value in the dog training videos. >> i make free videos for everyone out there to learn from on youtube. just look me up. zach, george. >> i love that. well, listen, i wonder from your perspective when you hear that this 14 months old wire haired point beautiful dogs, by the way, was out of her mind with excitement, chasing birds on a hein, attacking chickens. i wonder what you've made it

that this is an astonishing story to say the least. this, the behavior are described here is very typical adolescent behavior out of a dog that it's been selectively bred to have endless stamina and endurance. and it really speaks to the fact that the general public is deeply confused about dog behavior and how to treat them. that's something we advocate for a lot of my social media to try and help educate the public around modern humane treatment of dollars ogg's. >> and she says that she put the dog around other older dogs in a hunting setting to teach her how to behave. she talks about using an electronic color, but then at the same time, she calls a dog and i mean when you hear that, i mean, do you get the sense that she really tried her level best to actually train this dog i don't know what her personal best would be, but yeah, there

are many more appropriate ways to train dogs than that, especially with electric colors and aversive methods like this that rely on pain, fear, and intimidation. >> those are strongly correlated with increased aggression in dogs. now, many members of the public don't realize that that's one of the big problems that color's like electric collars and prong collars and choke chains are used aggressively to suppress behavior. but one of the things we're trying trying to raise awareness about is the fact that there are so many side effects and there's nothing that can't be trained with positive reinforcement training. and the good thing about positive reinforcement training and responsible management of the dogs environment, which was also lacking in this case this really is what people need it because it doesn't have the side effects. this is what more people need to be aware of there are probably a as, as she writes in her book, this idea

that maybe she finds all this conversation quite naive and thanks, hard choices are may you just don't understand what it's like? >> i think she references farm life in particular the idea of having to make tough decisions on farms and different parts of the country. what do you make of that? because i'm sure there are people who are listening and thinking. it's a dog which is certainly not my opinion. matter. but what do you say to people who look at this issue and think that we're being naive i. think really well i think i think i think i just blew his mind with that question. >> the idea the idea that someone would think it's not said that he was saying he was no words for what i've just said you respond to that thought process. >> i guess i understand. it's zach george. thank you for joining us. sorry that we couldn't finish that interview, but just to bring it here into the room, luck she had a hunting dog that has a pre instinct that's what these drugs do. their bread to do that philippe, your reaction to just the i cannot believe that

this is actually an anecdote that she thought reflected well on her i mean, watching everyone's faces while that was on. i mean, ever everyone's blood is boiling i am one of these people that not only loves animals and has always had pets, but just prefers them to people. we don't deserve them that she thought that that was a good idea. i mean, there's a special circle of held that's reserved for people who mistreat animals. it's a real window into it i was as i was leaving, i bumped into my neighbor and his dog, georgie. georgie doesn't really like me can see associates me with my two cats, but i jokingly said, georgie, i'm going to go on tv and i'm going to defend, your honor. and my neighbor said, do you think she said that because she doesn't want to be vp like his initial reaction and was how stupid can you be on a political basis? there's not a whole lot that keeps us all together. in fact, there's really nothing like moser america can agree that today is friday. pets and animal one of

them. i mean, i looked at the numbers at 6 million households at two-under very three have a dog or cat there are enough dogs in america that beat argentina, that beat thailand cats if they were own nation, would beat like bolivia. and i think they want to be their own nation. >> what makes her think that visits go to d and what i love about this, then i'll wrap is that republicans love to yellow people like me and democrats that we don't get america. we're living in a bubble. we like our kale, we like r de, i like all these things that we just don't get what goes on between the coast what america she living in where people think that it's a good idea to talk about, to do what she did. just walk around killing goats because they smell i mean, as if goats don't smell and to kill puppies because they bother her this is someone who thinks they're in touch. and what's most pathetic about

this is a donald trump won't care why. downtimes you only precedent, president in american history from what i could tell, that has never owned a pet i grew up in middletown, connecticut and myself and three older brothers and my wonderful parents who had passed. we lived on 100 acre farm and father had a lumber business and we had clydesdales. so i lived around horses and cows and dogs and cats. and all i can say is this the person who really wrote her book was dexter okay. the show? that is sick fan is sick. go back to 2012 romney. >> he put a dog in a cage on his car. >> yeah. yeah. >> and look at all that was yeah. he got committed suicide as a vp candidate. >> she will never be a vegan. you can't. the other part of this that that is hard hard to swallow is the way she flippantly mentioned her child showing up and finding the

dog-gone wild. that's what i i have a little bit of childhood trauma in that vein. and if you have if you have a kid, i would never do that to my child. it's just you gotta wonder why she put that in there if there's ten other things that she thought get this out there. >> yes. i shooting elephant junior or something? no. i think there's an element here where she thought this made her look masculine who are on the republican side? i'd pick up guns, talk about hunting more than they do. okay. i grew up in southern west virginia. i'm comfortable around those things, but they overstate it or they overdo it as a way to sort of take up that banner she doesn't think it's going to work against her by tenders a difference team yeah. one thing and execution. this to me as a character flaw coursera's. >> i just say something before we go. my dog hershey's better than all your dots know what word am i? what hershey's beds, all your di do that, booker t. >> i'd like i couldn't see

there's a tie that i had no time were all know her as for as, the columbia student protests leader who said, quote zionist, don't deserve to live has just it's actually been banned from campus. >> you would happen with cnn confronted them tonight, stay with riyadh two album is breaking records gets to say what country is comey country beyond, say a nashville's renaissance? >> streaming exclusively on mats raising use no better frozen. are you getting me anything for mothers de go to one 800 flowers.com gorgeous. i feel like royalty when 800 flowers.com, happy mother's day. >> mother's day. >> what is circle surplus the field to take flight circle is the energy that gets you to the next level. circled is which hoped for like tosses limited

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campus for saying hateful, anti-semitic things. >> cnn's miguel mark has confronted that student earlier zionist they don't deserve to live comfortably, let alone zionists don't deserve to live. commodity. james, a spokesperson for the student protests at columbia university, said this more than once in a personal social media post in january the same way we're very comfortable accepting that. >> nazis don't deserve he live fascist don't deserve to live racist, don't deserve to live zionist they shouldn't live in this world. >> confronted by cnn about his comments, james unapologetic. >> i think we need to shift the conversation from people's comfort to the hundreds of thousands of people who. have been displaced, the tens of

thousands of people who have been murdered by israel i think it harder your words help i think it's very important to your words. health. >> i think it's very important for people to understand that the conflation of anti zionism with anti-semitism is woefully incorrect and wrong again, what do you apologize? again? as i mentioned earlier we believe in the sanctity of life here at this encampment despite his calls for a the class of people to cease existing, james, nearly daily expresses his belief that israel is committing genocide while israel plants to move forward with its genocide backed by the united states. >> in other western powers it is important to remember why we are here after being confronted, james released a statement saying, in part, i am frustrated that the words i said in an instagram live video

have become a distraction for the movement for palestinian liberation i misspoke in the heat of the moment for which i apologize some just students at columbia say they have been called zionist by protesters just for being jewish. other jewish students have taken an active part in the protests for what they view as an overbearing israeli response to the october 7 hamas terror attack. and a weak us response to continued bloodshed it's possible that pro-palestine protest might make some jewish students feel uncomfortable, but i will emphasize that the pro-palestine protests here at the encampment are they have fundamental values against hate and bigotry our thanks to miguel mark has for that report from columbia university and up next our coverage continues right after this rising costs

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