listen to their remarks of pure hatred. >> fellow representative ilhan omar, did visit columbia today with her daughter, who's been arrested. >> and suspended during these protests, which kicked started this movement now in their eighth day talks with protesters continue. if they fail, say columbia administrators, they will have to consider options for restoring calm to campus here at ucla, error in a growing but peaceful protest. >> i think they learned from what happened at usc yesterday when security d and the police came in pretty heavy today, almost zero police or security visible presence. what's a bit odd is that even if you're a student here at ucla, right? now, you cannot walk across your campus because the protesters have put up a barricade and they won't let you through unless you register and wear a mask. they also weren't lead us in or let us

either and film from the outside aaron nick watt. thank you very much. those mass something we've started to see it all these protests toto conceal identity. thank you. and thanks to all of you. it's time for henderson good evening from new york or the tabloid publisher who said the former president was a mentor to him, described today what he did to help that mentor when the white house and high from washington, where the supreme court heard arguments today for and against making any former president immune from criminal prosecution. >> fusion for acts in office. and letting this one off the hook for trying to stay in the white house despite losing the election to courtrooms. >> two cases, one person at the center of both, which in itself is something that a single individual should be responsible for today's legal traffic jam. and tonight's split-screen special primetime converge here in new york. the former president's criminal trial continued with more testimony from his onetime friend and former tabloid publisher, david pecker. in it, pecker described his role in

suppressing the stories of karen mcdougal and stormy daniels, who both said they had a ferrets with donald trump this photo, one of several admitted into evidence today shows pecker& the former president walking past the white house, rose garden. former president asking him, at that moment, according to pecker, house, karen doing two which pecker says he replied, quote, she's doing well, she's quiet. everything is going good in another conversation, pecker said, trump referred to mcdougal is our girls. pecker also suggested that trump was angry about the interviews i did with her and stormy daniels when each broke their silence will bring you excerpts in our coverage tonight. >> in washington, the supreme court oral arguments were underway and the conservatives, who as we know, have a majority on the court, appeared to embrace at least some form of criminal immunity for presidents, the liberal minority, by contrast, focused on the temptation that might be it for a future president if they have that what i'm i more worried about using to be worried about the president being chilled. i think that we would have a really significant

opposite problem if the president wasn't chilled if someone with those kinds of powers, the most powerful person in the world with the greatest amount of authority could go into office knowing that there would be no potential penalty for committing crimes. i'm trying to understand what the disincentive is from turning the oval office into the the seat of criminal activity in this country in a moment, i'll be joined by former trump council, jim trusty, and also former white house counsel and the nixon administration, jon de, who was central to the last case at the supreme court, decided on whether presidents are above the law. >> anderson, of course, first with the criminal trial and that transcript that just came out from today. yeah. kaitlyn with me here, criminal defense attorney or there i dala, also former federal prosecutor jeffrey thuban, jessica roth from her house january 6 select committee senior investigative

counsel, temidayo aganga-williams, cnn senior legal analyst, elie honig, and cnn's bring jin grass, who was in court today. >> a lot of billable hours right here at the tail so brin let's talk more about what the scene he was like inside the courtroom yeah, it was i found it interesting the contrast between the finishing up of the direct and the cross-examinatio n, right. direct. we have seen over the last couple of days, it's very methodical. they go through every single detail, pulling back the curtain on those catch-and-kill schemes with pecker at bringing in the evidence text messages, how they discussed signal apps with michael cohen and then once we got to the cross, it was rapid fire, right? the defense was basically walking him through exactly, poking holes into what the cross i just spent days and hours doing with pecker. so i found that very interesting another thing i thought was so interesting and you just mentioned your interviews that you did also what was brought up, of course, as the access hollywood tape and all these details that very likely these jurors have heard prior to the 2016 election, they were extremely and enthralled. we were learning that their ping-pong ping-ponging back and

forth between the questions that were being asked and pecker's answer. so that was interesting. meanwhile, the former president sort of sat back, particularly during pickers direct his sack back with his arms crossed at times kinda closing his eyes, listening in a little bit more, but really not reacting much at all to what his former friend was saying on the stand, just feet away from him. so there was a lot of sort of quiet drama in a sense inside the courtroom, but you could certainly feel it, but you want to get quick quick takes from everybody about what stood out. i mean, le what's notice for the reason brands saying prosecutors so you do not high five at the end of direct exam. that's the easy part. and the change in pace and tone, the brand noted, i think it was interesting and i do think the defense has started to score some points and chip away at pecker's testimony. for example, they established this catch and kill stuff this capturing stories, doing favors for celebrities, putting pressures on celebrities. donald trump did not invent that. that's been going on since the beginning of tabloid journalism. that's important context for the jury to understand. michael cohen. >> i thought i think they scored a nice point when they established michael cohen is

always playing an angle for himself. >> they got that out of the state's witness out of the da's witness. and the last thing think was there's a contradiction in an important part of pecker's testimony where he says now that hope hicks was at this crucial meeting where they first started discussing this plan. but it turns out he didn't say that the first time he was asked by investigators. now, i'm not saying he's ruined as a witness, but this is the back-and-forth. i think he did a good job on direct. i'd be happy with it if i was the prosecutor, but now sit back because now he's taking taking on some damage thibodaux yes. >> speaking from my time as a prosecutor, i agree. i think i would be happy if this were my witness. i think what stands out as something we talked about the other night actually, is that it's quite easy to point the finger at someone else, but i think what happened today is that pecker point they figured himself, he basically admitted that he was part of a criminal conspiracy, and he talked importantly about election crimes and his own concern that exactly what they were doing. violet with that, he actually had raised concerns and said they sought out legal counsel on that at the time? >> exactly. and i think that's incredibly damaging because the

real one of the competing narratives here is we talked thinking about a personal matter in this hush money, which is what everyone does. it's what rich people do two stories. are we talking about a campaign violation? are we talking about people entering into conspiracy because they know they are trying to influence an election. and that is at the core of the prosecution's case. and today, david pecker said, that's exactly what was going on what's what i heard about elie, i believe he's absolutely correct. >> the cross-examination, they made some points right out of the box and the way you described the britain going like provable bubble, that's what you want and you only get one chance to make a first impression on this jury. this is the first big cross-examination you what the jurors to know right off the bat here, you're going to hear all these nice prepared, totally rehearsed a direct examinations, or watch what happens. watch what happens, watch how we fillet that. once we dig into the details and apparently i had a friend who was in the courtroom. he said

empty, then we'll first hour-and-a-half course examination. i wanted to take a shower after hearing how filthy that tabloid industry is.& he really i don't know the details, but apparently it was a lot about arnold schwarzenegger when he was going to run and all the things that they buried with, right right. >> pecker was testifying that orange schwarzenegger had actually and in contact with him about essentially doing the same kind of catch and kill sort of stuff. yeah. and i think i made the analogy today they're like, well, what's the big deal about bringing it out if a jury is there and they're listening to a crime and someone's like talking about how horrible double parking is. but then you have 18 other people's will double park and you double pocket, you double park. >> as it's going to pick up on that point, that which is to say, what are the things that's significant about establishing that that ami did this for lots of other people. is it tends to negate the idea

that this was done for an election purpose, right? if they're catching and killing stories for lots of other celebrities, schwarzenegger was, was running thing for governor, right walberg wasn't, right. >> i mean, there are other people for whom attacker was saying we would do this. and so i think at the end of the day, pecker was still a very effective witness for the prosecution. i think there's lots of answers to this. and he talked about how we got close to the election for president trump. that the concern that trump expressed was about the effect on his campaign. but nevertheless, i think establishing that this was standard operating procedure normalizes it, makes it seem arguably like it's less related to the campaign itself, which is important. but overall, i thought he was an excellent witness and also significantly, he showed no bias toward trump. i mean, not only was he not deflecting responsibility for his own criminal conduct, but he was saying that he still considered the former president a friend. >> he didn't come off 70 like he had an extra he wasn't he wasn't holding anything back and he had no extra ghraieb it. if i were donald trump, i would

be so happy about what happened in washington today. i wouldn't even care what happened in the courtroom today because i think supreme court really signal that we are not going to see any other trials this year. we'll get to that later tonight. i know. >> but the value to the prosecution of pecker is that he laid out the frame of the story. now, the jury understands that there were these three three witnesses, three paid that is all going to be filled out. maybe they'll believe it, maybe they won't you know, your idea that this is so terrible and and and, you know, this is just business as usual. who was their partner in all of this? >> donald trump? you don't think the jury is going to be somewhat offended that this guy who's running for president and the united states is involved with all these sleazebags that he buried, that he buried his sex story, which you heard from their witness. so did this through celebrity sorted that celebrities started this celebrity sorted that celebrity. so this celebrity that it happens all the time, it's not unique. oh, my god,

they came this isn't watergate. that's my point. that watergate was a very unique time. it's the first time it's like that. happened what came out of cross examination is this happens all the time, but bringing it back to a temidayo said a moment ago. but this time they consulted the lawyers and then they started to back off because they realized that they were veering into territory with respect to the campaign that made them nervous about the money with the money that's what matters here, is the money. >> but if i could jump off of what you're we're saying on the stand. pecker is very composed during direct. he's very composed if he doesn't know an answer, he wouldn't say he would say i don't know. he wouldn't hesitate. he he was very believable and credible when he was testifying on direct they didn't get to the crux of what this case is, which is stormy daniels because of course, pecker didn't pay stormy daniels, right? he said i'm not a bank after paying the other two stories. so the question is now sure he's credible, but most of the stories not going to come from him. so are they going to find michael cohen credible who has an ax to grind against donald

trump. pecker like to your point? >> but said he was my mentor. he was very nice, he was very believable. and this real stories coming from someone else and further in the trial, this is a classic dilemma. you see it all trials when prosecutors are almost always going to build their case to some extent on testimony from people who are involved in the crime, cooperating witnesses, people who've been given immunity, like david pecker and defense lawyers say, how can you convict based on the heart of this sleazebags? how can you base convict based on the word of this convicted liar coming up later, et cetera. and prosecutors, we have our standard thing. we've all done it where you say, guess who chose this guy, right? the defendant chosen when chose to go into business with him when he chose michael cohen is his lawyer, so that's who we're going to show you that that's how we're going to prove this. this case two, and the task for prosecutors now is jessica was pointing out is explaining why this transaction was different from mark wahlberg or schwarzenegger and different in a way that takes it over the line of criminality. >> it is they're seeing that all of the people who are going to be in that courtroom where people in the orbit of donald trump. i mean, it's not as if

they are random strangers. they are the people who trump chose to have in his life. >> i think when we talk about this dirt that spread around, i think if my abdominal froms laura is i'm worried about that dirt being on donald trump. >> right? this is this is the former president and i think that's what's really going to be important here right now. i think the standard of this is watergate. that's not the standard here. right? and i think a jury where they get their jury charge from the judge, that's not gonna be the charge. he's going to give them. they don't have to find that this was i don't know the charge is going to get your though. it's not gonna be that there has to be the crime of the century. that's not a majority i do these fascinating when you see that black and white photo of donald trump walking past the rose garden with david pecker and we have seen heads of state walking down that we've seen people have consequence walking down that and to know who david pecker is now, and to know what donald trump is saying. hey, right there, which is essentially house karen doing she going to shut up later in the trial, we are going to see checks that donald trump signed

to according to the prosecution, to pay michael cohen back for the money he gave photo in black and white and you feel it's historic torque and these are important people and talking about important things. and they're talking about a hush money dealing and talent were signed in the oval office while he was president of the united states might mean more of what we're learning from the courtroom transcripts, which is just fascinating. and x caitlin back with his geoff mentioned a moment ago, today's supreme court oral arguments and presidential immunity would the justices as both sides and justice gorsuch, today's said, quote, we are writing a rule for the ages so phi is helping me get my money right to achieve my ambitions, like earning more money on my money's ahead, shop, ready for service thank with sofi to earn a higher apy and an epic welcome bonus because it looks like an actual farm looks cute on the app i have love it at a

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keepsake app. we would love a chance to frame it for you five good things. >> listen wherever you get your podcasts after nearly three hours of oral arguments before the supreme court today, the justices did not seem willing to embrace former president trump's anything goes interpretation of presidential immunity. >> but instead, much of the hearing instead focused on where to draw the distinction between the official acts of a president and their private conduct. here's conservative justice amy coney barrett questioning the president's attorney, john sauer you can see the private acts don't get immunity. >> we do. okay. and i want to

know if you agree or disagree about the characterization of these acts is private. petitioner turned to a private attorney, was willing to spread knowingly false claims of election fraud to bare head is challenges to the election results. private dining we dispute the allegation, but sounds private. >> took sounds private. >> petitioner conspired with another private attorney who caused the filing and court of a verification signed by petitioner that contain false allegations to support a challenge. >> so sounds private. >> three private actors to attorneys, including those mentioned above, and a political consultant helped implement a plan to submit fraudulent slates of president shall electors to obstruct the certification proceeding and petitioner and a coconspirator attorney directed that effort you ready to quickly i believe that dr. so of today's arguments also focused on for president richard nixon and his legal entanglements and held that precedent reflects on today and what that means. i'm joined tonight by the former counsel to form president trump, jim trusty, former federal prosecutor, elliot

williams, georgetown law professor victoria nurse, and former federal prosecutors chan woo, and also someone very familiar with the legal legacy left behind by richard nixon, the former president's onetime white house counsel, john dean and john, let me start with you, given how watergate i think we all knew it was going to come up at some point, but this is how trump's attorney responded when justice ketanji brown jackson raised this question about president nixon what was up with a pardon for president nixon i think if everybody thought that presidents couldn't be prosecuted than what was that about? well, he was under investigation, froze private and public conduct at the time john, given that i wonder what you made of how just over ten minutes after that trump's attorney also acknowledged that that allegation by jack smith in that indictment includes both private and official acts my reaction was that there's a very thin read there for them to draw upon ford clearly

thought president ford clearly thought that nixon could be prosecuted and di, he, thought he was getting confession from nixon when he issued the pardon, he actually carried around in his, in his pocketbook are and as wallet a site of a case that said in essence by the supreme court that acceptance of a pardon was admission of guilt. so the whole assumption back then was that presidents had no immunity. >> they it could not commit crimes without having exposure. and unless there was just a passing by the department of justice on taking action, indeed, they were had jeopardy. so the situation is dramatically changed and nixon's onetime prediction that if the president does it, that means it's legal seemed to come to beyer today on the conservative justices on the court. >> yeah, i was remembering how we reported at the end of trump's term in office, he actually forbade people from bringing up nixon comparisons

to him, often with a lot of expletives because he was tired of hearing those comparisons. but but on the argument that trump's attorney did concede today, thank that. some of those accusations are private acts that trump did. what did you make of that shift well, i thought it was a surprising admission since they've stonewalled on everything. >> they just couldn't get around arguing that some of those acts were not official acts, even though trump has pretended that everything he did while he was still president was an official act so we'll see how far that goes. they are the issues he conceded to. he must think he has a factual argument that he can make that somehow diminishes the impact of what's going on but caitlin, i was just surprised at the courts focus and seeming determination by the republican members to write them an immunity of some kind. four presidents. it is just not the right case to do that. and

it's just going to really be a threat to democracy. to have them foolishly write something. just for the sake of this case. >> yeah, it was remarkable to listen to it inventory when you hear that you're shaking your head? yes. what john di was just saying there. >> i've been a law professor for about 30 years and i study the separation powers and the text of the constitution. and i have to say, i was just it's very sad today i've never heard anything like this. they said in dobbs that women don't have a right of abortion because it's not in the text. they believe they're textualists, but they're just about to make up some text for donald trump. so they did not they had an opportunity to put country above party and they did not. they refuse to talk about the facts. this official immunity doctrine is only applied in civil cases, not criminal cases. so i have to say it was a dispiriting moment for me because i teach my students at georgetown to follow the rule of law. i tell them i'm a moderate because i have no friends on the left or

the right. >> and it was really a dispiriting day for me. well, joan trustee, i mean, you were on trump's defense team. obviously, you are not any longer, but what did you make of of how the arguments went today? >> i'm not crying in my beer that this was a breakdown of law and order that's not actually beer. well, not yet. >> but it's only about 8:15 no. look, i mean, honestly, i give a lot more credit to the conservative side of the bench on this, and i'll say a couple of things. one is i actually i like to sit in judgment on the advocacy of the parties, whatever my stake is, whatever my interest is and i've known my dreeben for a long time. i don't know sour but but i think he was arguing on behalf of the federal. am i actually think that it was a really intellectually interesting debate going on today, and that the party, i didn't, i didn't agree with everything that either side said but i thought that the way they presented themselves or comfort in the supreme court is something that's pretty impressive. >> so if i'm talking to my students i'd say whatever wherever you come out on from this one, watch the advocacy, watch how they respond to the

court, watch their knowledge of history and the history of the supreme court and learn something because there's something to learn from both sides. but in terms of the court, there's a couple of things they are looking at context and texts and trying to figure out the history, whether its executive immunity but they're also not blind to the current context and the current context is craziness of ambitious prosecutors around the country, throwing together very unique, very creative ways of going after the the conservative justices didn't really seem to address the trump factor of it at all. they seem to talk about what it meant for future presidents while not dealing with the allegations about this former and potentially future president, right? >> well, yeah, the one thing that's here's the real sad part of the story, which is they can come up with this line, this kind of mark in the continuum between personal and presidential and say this is the line where immunity begins or ends. have you want to phrase it? they'll probably do that. they're not in a position to make the factual call on these cases. so what's going to happen? i think if they established that there is in fact this kind of qualified

are limited form of immunity, not the absolute kind of craziness, but if there's a limited form, it's going to go back to the trial courts to figure out, are these facts when and how do i figure out if the facts of this case give rise or don't give rise to immunity. so we may be seeing trial courts dealing with this issue. circuits supreme court saying going the supreme court saying, you guys gave this test a year ago. we're back. >> well, notable to hear you say craziness of trump's absolute immunity claim, elliott, what did you what do you make of what no, i think you're you're absolutely right. >> i think the court in sort of recognizing well, i think trump's team in conceding that some things might be official acts and some things are not really open the door to the supreme court to say, well, we can't decide what's an official act and what isn't. we're just going to send it back down to lower courts to figure out now to be clear, the supreme court could have resolved this issue back in december and we're not even talking about that hearing at which remember, judge florence pan talked about the drone

strike by seal team six or when a block before that, the supreme court have this issue because jack smith's team took it to the supreme court, said, we would like you to expedite this ruling. can you please rule on this issue and they chose not? two for this reason. they want to keep their hands out of it to some extent and push it back down to lower courts. >> and because jack speedy trial thing was absurd on its face. well, given can we talk about justice alito in shan, what he raised today, which was essentially, if you do allow former president's to be prosecuted, then the least so worried about being prosecuted once they leave office that they'll do unlawful things to stay in that office. >> it was a complete reversal of that argument. yeah. i'm not sure he understood the effect of that point. i think justice ketanji brown had indicated that it would become the seat of criminality rather than the seat of power if you allow that type of absolute immunity. this whole notion that they may send back or establish a test. i think it's just nonsense because they basically want to have a bunch of minnie trials in every scenario to determine, is it an official akre not? and

you know, something we already have a system to determine that it's called a criminal trial and they should just let it go forward because the way that they're fashioning this is completely unworkable and it's never been needed for the past 250 years and probably won't be needed again for another 250 years were you surprised by justice amy coney barrett, who? >> he seem to kind of agree with that in the sense that these are questions a jury could answer. >> yes. i mean, i think that's what's going to happen, but the problem is the whole framing around official immunity. >> that's in a civil case, not a criminal case. >> so they took trump's framing of this question and then they're running with it and that is going to cause enormous delay and confusion. they mentioned the state cases and georgia in new york. >> so if i'm a lawyer in those cases, i'm going to bring that up so the problem is they had a statesman like option which is say, the president is not immune. >> and they didn't choose it. >> we'll see what this ruling looks like when we get it coming up. we're going to go back to anderson in new york and what we're learning from the transcript, the full quote

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>> misinformation, don't you also live in reports from the front lines, fair knows, taylor swift has a government site. >> you don't believe tellers i don't know what to believe the full transcript from today's hush money trial testimony during our live coverage of the trial, we have happening and being said, but the transcripts really give a fuller picture of what occurred. >> john berman joins us now, i know you've been going through them. there's a lot of pages what stands out in speed reading literally we just got the last bit right here. >> there are tears there. one of the thing that jumps out to me is how many times david pecker test fide to having conversations specifically with donald trump was mostly about karen mcdougall, but there is one point of the transcript already talked to trump about stormy daniels and i miss that initially during the day when it happened and this is part of that cross-examine this is actually during direct josh dying glass, the prosecutor said did mr. trump contact you

in connection with ms daniels appearance on anderson cooper, becker says, yes, he did. stein glass. can you describe for the jury had that conversation went? david pecker says, when mr. trump called me, he said to the same, he asked me if i saw the stormy daniels interview with anderson cooper. i said, yes, i did. he said that we have an agreement with stormy daniels that she cannot mention my name or do anything like this dollar. joe stein glasses. that's what donald trump told you packer. that's what he told me i'm jeff. >> you've recently interviewed stormy daniels. does she there is some money. she'll well, its own a desperate problem for stormy daniels when she was representing attended by michael ava naughty of blessed memory he sued donald trump on her behalf for defamation that

case was not only thrown out of court, but the judge in california awarded attorney's fees to donald trump because the judge said the case was frivolous. >> those were assessed best against the client, stormy daniels, not against the lawyer that debt which has been multiplying over the years is currently about $670,000. so stormy daniels owes donald trump at this moment about $670,000 and has essentially no chance of discharge in that debt because it's been appealed and it's been upheld. this is something that i suspect the trump's lawyers are going to use when she testifies to talk about her bias and anger. now, she has lots of things in her favor. she is actually a very good witness. she testified against michael avenatti in his criminal trial in manhattan. and the jury clearly believed her. i mean, she is a believable person, but she does

have an ax to grind against donald trump and that is going to be brought out in front of the jury. >> i mean, it was interesting because trump will also pecker testified that he gotten angry call from trump also about another interview i did which was with karen mcdougal in 2018. pecker said, so mr. trump said when he called me, he said, did you see anderson cooper interview with karen mcdougal? i said yes. he said i thought you had and we had an agreement with karen mcdougal that she can't give any interviews or beyond any television shows. so i said, yes. i said we had an agreement by amended it to allow her to speak to the press. does trump got very aggravated when he heard that i mended it. he couldn't understand why i said karen had a two-year agreement. she was flooded with requests from the press for interviews and i amended her agreement at that time, trump said, well, then you paid her. i said yes, i paid her an amended the agreement. he was very upset. he couldn't understand why i did it. in quote, i just want to play what karen mcdougal actually said during the interview or not, we don't have it why would he have why would

he have amended? >> i don't understand why would david pecker have amended that agreement with karen mcdougal? >> it's not, clear to me either. i mean, the he had an independent business relationship with karen mcdougal. she was a columnist for one of his outdoor fitness magazines he i don't know why he wanted to do that, and obviously, trump did know why either and he was and you sent me off donald trump. what's up and down that well, it's not the first time. >> what i think is also significant about these passages is that it shows direct contact between david pecker and donald trump and a lot of pecker's testimony was going through michael cohen, the vast majority he was communications about karen mcdougal and stormy daniels. we're through michael cohen, but as prosecutor, you want to be able to point to these exact excerpts and say donald trump himself knew what was going on. it was very invested and not

just conversation der conversations, but conversations and statements saying like we have an agreement with stormy daniels according to pecker, which gets to donald trump's state of mind that he knew there for these agreements in place because they were for his benefit. and that's the thing. is that one of the issues here is, did donald trump thing like, why did these agreements take place? the agreements took place for donald trump's benefit to get elected president of the united states. those quotes which you just raid show that he new, that's why these agreements were in place. and he was angry when he thought they were being violated the fact that pecker saying that there was a catch and deal killed deal with arnold schwarzenegger is reportedly before he ran for governor, or he said he testified that he suppressed a story about rama manuals have favor to run manuals. >> brother ra, who's a big time agent then i guess we've seen and has reached out for comment from them and others mentioned today, i should point that out. does any of that matter, what is the significance? >> the significance is look, it's going to be an underlying

current year by the defense of jury nullification. like so what so what let's you i to say everything the prosecutor says is true and they satisfy the elements of the crime which crazy crime, but so what big deal everyone else is doing it, everyone's and what this, what this case is all about. it's not a crime and figuring out who did it it's we got this guy here and now we got to figure out what he did to try to convict him, you think in a case of this magnitude, a case with all this attention, jurors one, with this one. well, but the jury is going to say, well, we need is one. we think he's guilty, but we're going to just not give you are you kidding me? i mean, cope you don't think there's someone who could be so annoyed that a guy who's running for president united states is sitting there for six or eight weeks when he should be out doing something fundraising, campaigning, or golfing with people who matter and they're holding me, you

don't think there's one or two people out there like this was totally a crime that's a bs little crime and they just did this to keep him off. that's election to fill maybe one person who does that. i think your mistake, i think in any trial, there could always be one person, but i think what's more likely is there people are going be offended, that in an election that's supposed to be about the will of the people they're not getting all the information about the candidate. and i think that's what the prosecution is going to keen on. we can talk about this like it's not the big crime and whatnot, but i think what they've effectively done it, so that donald trump thought that it was the ports, the chance of him running the free world that when he was attacking his other candidates like ted cruz, he thought this was so important that he should drag them down so i think yes, there's always a concern about jury nullification, but his defense lawyers cannot argue that you are not permitted to organize the jury, that they should not follow the law and what the judge told them at the start is that you are obligated told. okay. and you know what i

tell them, i say he's a justice of the supreme court. this says justice but who determines what justice is in this courtroom? the 12 of view you determine what justice dictates. you determine the outcome of this case also wanted them raised dispensary doesn't also raised questions about what others does down trump have business-related, whatever that might compromise him in office? i mean, if he's walking down in the white house chatting with david catches and we think he's doing the people who visit but he is actually hush money business. i mean, aren't there all sorts of questions like, how else is he potentially compromise? could you say? get about everyone a bill, about bill clinton? you couldn't say about bill clinton, who i think was a great president certainly, a lot of other things on his mind. >> i don't know that every politician is like that. i don't know why not every politician, but i think what you're at that level& to get to that level yet, there's always some, some something in your background. >> i don't think stormy daniels is probably the worst thing donald trump did. i agree. there's probably a lot more stuff he needed to cover up. then this, but this is this

is the issue of the moment coming up. >> next, we'll take a short break for this sort of bringing my conversation today with the parents of hersh goldberg-polin, an american israeli has been a hostage in gaza, going on 202 days. it's parents had not gotten any word whether he was alive or not. they knew his left-handed been blown off part of his left arm. finally, they got a proof of life videos. there was let's yesterday. i'm going to talk to them about it rsv is out there for those 60 years and older detect against rsv with a wreck sv, a rx is a vaccine used to prevent lower respiratory disease from rsv. and people 60 years and older, wreck speed is not protect everyone and is not for those with severe allergic reactions to its ingredients, those weakened immune systems may have a low response to the vaccine the most common side effects or injection site pain, fatigue, muscle pain, headache, and joint pain. >> i chose are xv rsv make it a wreck. sv real two.com is the

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vip family, you can unlock deals five times faster. you don't even have to be an actual family. >> i'd be the dad on the day physically, it's clear that i'm the dad. >> okay. so which dad is pain? >> did you know there's no t in skechers? >> what he's told about has always been scheduled and these sketches slippery cnvs get to slip bands ready to wisdom, is getting romo, things always in sketchup i'm omar jimenez at columbia university. >> and this is for more than six months, jonathan polin and rachel goldberg have lived as best they can in a nightmare, hoping that their son hersh she was abducted by gunmen last october 7 during the hamas terror attack, was still alive. >> there last images of him were from this video, retrieved from the body cam or phone of a gunman hersh, his left hand, and part of his arm had been blown off, likely by a grenade being forced into the back of a

truck. i was initially shown this video by an israeli soldier and i recorded it. john and rachel had not seen the video when i happened to interview them a couple of days later realizing it was their son, i'd seen i call them after the interview and i sent them this video was the first time they saw their son being taken they later decided to make it public so people could see what hamas did to their child. and so many other innocent people we've been talking with john, rachel ever since as they waited for word, any word of their son? yesterday, they got it a hostage video. we're only showing a frame of it unclear when it was made seems recently, but his wound appears to have healed and he is alive on it. he are was alive at least when this was made on it. he said he loves his parents and he misses them. i spoke with john and rachel earlier today regional john, thank you so much for talking to us how did you learn about this video? did you know it was about to come out? >> we knew, that it was both

come out maybe 45 minutes before it came out. i got a call from there was representation from the us and from israel on the line saying, we haven't seen it, we don't know what it is, but there is a video coming out on telegram and that's how we found out. and then we saw it when the rest of the world sought i what was that like? >> you know, it's actually interesting that you're asking this because i think that it was a lot like when we saw the video that you shared with us, although for us now, it was, you know, after 201 days. i mean, we were sobbing tears and emotional overwhelmed feelings we're just a bounding we weren't even listening to what he was saying, just hearing his voice and seeing him moving.

and that he was alive was like my heart started racing and we were just solving i would say that it was hopeful. >> we've had hope because we have two for 202 yesterday, 201 days but there's still something about seeing and hearing your loved one for the first time and so long mixed with concern, which is to say that we parents know our kids best and we know what it looks like and not only is his arm missing, which we've known about since we got your video on day ten or 11. but he doesn't look right coloring is off, but you'd expect that after wondered plus days in a tunnel. but he looks a little bit puffy, his face, his neck, his shoulders could be due to a number of factors but there was

mixed, mixed emotions here. it lights a fuel, it lights a fire under is even more than we've already had two bring him and the other hundred and 32 hostages home as fast as we can from the earliest days that we have all talked with each other, you had told me when we sat down in jerusalem in your house that doctors had reached out to you saying that the wounds that they saw in the video so looked treatable& that gave you hope and then even months later you heard from veterinarians when word got out that another hostage had been treated by veterinarians, veterinarians reach out to you to say you know what, don't worry about that because actually a vet could even work on hersh's hand and it would be okay. i mean, when i saw this, i looked at the video not so much to hear what he said, but more to see how he was and you could tell that wound seems

to have healed yeah. >> i mean, we did hear from many surgeons explaining that it's healing well, but that they were explaining what the next steps are that he needs to have treatment the sooner the better in terms of permanent nerve damage in terms of getting a prosthesis that will you know, behave the way it's supposed to. you have to have certain stimulation rehabilitation done as soon after the amputation as possible, which obviously this has been a huge delay in treatment. so we are concerned about that. >> but he's alive and there are so many families that don't have that proof that we just feel very blessed, that we got that. and to hear him say, mom and dad, to hear him say you know, your your daughter's

names that must have just been incredible well, it's interesting because you know, we never use hebrew with our kids. >> so it was it was kind of like kissing someone through a veil because that's not the language that we use at home. but it's his voice and we appreciated that message at the end that you're describing when he talks directly to us. and the message was very clear. and i don't know how who scripted it or where it was coming from, but i'll take it he also mentioned anderson to the first two minutes and 15 seconds of the video. maybe somebody else scripted it maybe it's hersh's words. i don't think so it doesn't even

matter i've just was immediately grabbed by those last 30 seconds. and touched by it obviously and sending all of the same sentiments right back at hersh, hoping that he hears and nose and sees that we love him. we miss him, and we are working to get him home as best as we can, just as he said in the video with the other thing that really struck me about what he said is that he said i'm not quoting directly, but i know you i know you've been doing everything you can and and he said, you stay strong for me and it was just interesting because as you know, i've probably said 1 million times over 1 million times at this point, over these 202 days. i love you, stay strong, survive. i love you stay strong. survive.

>> and so to hear him use that sort of language, which i'm assuming he has not heard us say and. >> to say i know you're working so hard i don't know if he knows that, but it was it was very meaningful for us and powerful for us to hear that you and your family just celebrated passover this week. i mean, it's a celebration of freedom of hope no matter how dark things get, there, is a way out what did i mean, did how was this passover well, passover is actually a week long, but the first two days when you're outside of israel, you do a seder dinner. >> when you're in israel, you do just one night of seder dinner and we were very great nervous going into this dinner because as you said, it's normally a commemoration of the jewish people leaving captivity leaving egypt and going on to

be a free people and the idea that we were going to celebrate freedom when our entire being soul and heart is being held captive, just felt perverse. it was not a celebration of freedom. it was a plea and beseeching of asking for freedom for hersh and the other 132 hostages families of hostages don't need any reminder ever of the fact that we are dealing with real people but maybe the world needs that reminder. >> maybe the negotiators sitting in rooms need that reminder. if this video plays one small piece in reminding the negotiators that you are dealing with real human beings with aspirations and families who love them and are working every day to bring them home. >> maybe that's a little bit of good that comes out of this

for the process. today was a milestone you know, 17 of the 25 nations that have citizens who are still being held in gaza in captivity along with hur's, signed a joint statement demanding for the release of their people and the truth is, it shouldn't take that but we're glad that it happened. that that people are starting that country's leaders are starting to galvanize and say, this is absolute insanity. it's been over half a year. these people need to come home and especially we believe that that would be a real diffusion of such tremendous tension that we have throughout the region right now and there's six words, rachel, that you always say, which is, i love you, stay strong, survive. >> i keep thinking about that over and over in my head. i mean, what more is there to say? that's it says it all yeah. and i really you know, we

have hundreds of thousands of people who reach out to us it is truly empowering. >> they're all different types of people from all different backgrounds, from all different places on earth and they say, we are saying that to him. and i don't know how the universe works but he might here you. so you should really try to say it to i love you, stay strong, survive rachel goldberg, jon polin. thank you thanks, andrew lot more in the next hour on the two big legal stories of the day, we're continuing to go through the batch of court transcripts we've just gotten in the trump hush money trial and kaitlan back from washington with interview with one of the foreign president's attorneys who was at the supreme court this morning for oil shop etsy until may 12 and get up to 30% off special mother's day gifts that go beyond the usual suspects but if she wants candles, our

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day here in new york, where the former president is on trial for what he allegedly did to become president. and here in washington anderson history was being made as well. and i supreme court court case, which flows from his scheme to remain in office and his claim that he should not be held criminally accountable for that. i'm joined tonight by one of the attorneys representing donald trump in the immunity case before the supreme court will scharf, who was at today's supreme court, oral arguments. i should note, he is also running from missouri attorney general. we're not going to get into that tonight. >> it's great to have you there. you are sitting in the second seat as these arguments are playing out today, i heard something today that i had never heard from your team before, which was john sauer saying that yes, some of the allegations and jack smith's indictment are indeed private x what led to the change from your team? >> well, i think we've always conceded, first of all, that there is no presidential immunity. before he president's private acts in office. i think we've also conceded that obviously president trump engaged in many private acts during the time period in question. i thought in many respects the much more damning concession, if you

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