>> alec baldwin facing a new renewed possibility of charges in the fatal shooting on the movie set of the movie rust. independent gun testing on the movie gun used on the -- trigger of the gun had to be pulled. the gunfire normally did not malfunction according to the report, file as part of a defense motion on behalf of the armorer, who has been charged in the case. the report, which was compiled by forensic science or misses in arizona, appears to open the door to the possibility of filing new charges against baldwin in the shooting of cinematographer hutchins in 2021. a program reminder. this saturday at 8:00 the am eastern, cnn will air its original series, giuliani -- what happened to america's mayor? major giuliani went from one of america's most famous crime fighters to one of america's most election and notorious election deniers.

again, that is going to take place saturday 8:00 pm eastern right here on cnn. the news continues. "the source" with kaitlan collins starts now. >> tonight, straight from the source -- i have new reporting on how rudy giuliani is learning the hard way there's a hard use huge price to pay for pushing trump's election lies. and the ex president who demands loyalty doesn't often reciprocate. what my sources are saying about a mar-a-lago meeting and giuliani's big ask. was, the prosecutor in georgia with an ambitious trial line. she wants trump in court the day before super tuesday. could the 2024 front-runner be in front of a judge for most of that election year? and hawaii's governor says that more than 1000 people tonight are still potentially missing, as fema is acknowledging challenges in the relief efforts there, we'll get an update from a top official and a new look at some of the harrowing scenes on the ground. i am kaitlan collins and this is the source.

we begin tonight, though, with some exclusive new reporting on the hundreds of thousands of dollars in legal fees that rudy giuliani is now staring down, and the desperate attempts that he has made to get former president donald trump to cover them. with his attorney in tow, i am told that rudy giuliani traveled to mar-a-lago in late april on a mission to make a personal appeal to trump to pay his legal bills. by going in person, giuliani and that lawyer, robert costello, believe they could help explain face to face why trump needed to assist his attorney with those ballooning legal bills. they argued that, really, it was in trump's best interests to do so. but apparently it fell on deaf ears. trump's notoriously strict about digging in his to his own coffers. he did not seem very interested, i'm told, in covering that everything that giuliani and costello wanted. one source that he verbally agreed to help but he didn't

commit to any specific amount or timeline. another source tells me the that trump really only agreed to pay only a small feet from a data vendor that was hosting giuliani records. i am told that -- $140,000 while -- seven figure range. giuliani's trip to mar-a-lago is not been previously reported. we're telling you first about it here on the source tonight. but it does indicate the level of financial stress he's been facing for months now. some people in trump's inner circle were actually surprised by trump's unwillingness to pay for giuliani's bills, given that he could find himself under intense pressure to cooperate, with state and federal prosecutors who have now charged trump. giuliani already sat down voluntarily with jack smith's team this summer in two back-to-back sessions. he's now a codefendant in the election interference case in georgia. he's facing criminal 13 criminal charges, like trump, and potentially serious prison time. it's not out of character for trump to not want to pay legal fees. it's something we've heard for from many of his attorneys in the that's, including his

former attorney michael cohen, when i sat down with him last month. >> history repeats itself. one thing we know for certain is that donald does not pay legal fees. donald doesn't pay fees at all. there's a pattern to what he does. he will pay a little bit, fall behind, pay a little more, fall bigger behind. >> i'm joined now by former white house counsel under president nixon john dean. john, good to see you again. what do you make of when you hear that rudy giuliani is going to mar-a-lago making this desperate plea? trying to get trump to pay for his legal fees and trump not really reciprocating on most of that? >> i think that trump is aware that during watergate for example, the payment of legal fees got lawyers in a lot of trouble, as for the joint defense agreements. the fact that he is not paying, though, is a pattern of this man, as michael just said. he just doesn't like to pay his

bills. so, he will have people come after him to get the fees. he had an agreement with michael. and michael had to go to court to get his fees paid. so, kaitlan collins, there is no surprise here. and trump, i think, is willing to tough it out. he doesn't think rudy giuliani will flip. >> that is a concern. i think people -- well, the michael cohen effect -- people have said that trump has kind of change his tactics there because of a concern of it turning into a michael cohen situation, potentially. >> i doubt that rudy will. rudy knows the inner workings of the system better than most of the former u.s. attorney from the southern district of new york. he knows particularly the rico law. he will try to poke holes, he will think he can prevail. he certainly, at the motion stage, the early stage of this proceeding is not likely to flip. it's only if the government of

georgia can overwhelm him and he realizes he's gonna go down and maybe he can save himself some years by cracking a deal. >> i sat down with bill barr, trump's former attorney general, of course, as you know. the other week -- and he had this to say what he has seen he says, happen to people who were in trump's orbit. >> he leaves in his wake ruined lives like this, the people who went up to capitol hill. these individuals -- many of the people who served him in government who got sucked into things. and it just leaves all this carnage in his wake. >> do you think he cares about that? >> no, he doesn't care about that. loyalty is a one-way street for him. >> john, do you think rudy giuliani ends up as more carnage here if he hasn't already in some people's view? >> i think he will. i think he's in deep trouble. the government's case looks like it's overwhelming. his federal issues have not

been resolved. trump could not pardon him in georgia if indeed he is convicted in georgia. i don't think trump is going to make it back to the white house. i think people are starting to get a glimmer of what that could be and they don't want it. maybe more republicans will do that before the primary vote i don't know. they are slow learners, apparently. so, i think rudy is going to get destroyed by this. it's sad but true. >> if he is as out of money as his attorney was arguing in court today that he is, the anti reason that the attorney was in or was that he was arguing he cannot pay what he is being ordered to pay as part of that smartmatic lawsuit. what does he do in that situation? does he represent himself? what options does rudy giuliani have at that point? >> he can get a court appointed lawyer at some stage.

representing yourself is the worst option because anyone who represents themself is likely to make bad decisions about that representation. i think rudy is likely to go into chapter 11 or bankruptcy of some sort. i understand his apartment is on the market. it could raise several million dollars, but he probably has a lot of debt he has to handle immediately as well. so, i think bankruptcy is a potential and maybe a court appointed attorney. >> that would be kind of remarkable, in the worst way, if someone who was once known as america's mayor, the role that he had after 9/11 has been then potentially, as you predict could happen, was then represented by court appointed attorney and then filing bankruptcy to cover his legal fees. >> it has a shakespearean element about it, although i don't really think of shakespeare when i look at rudy. and some of the news clips of

him recently -- it does have that kind of tragic tale that is being told in front of us. so, we will have to all watch. and no one wishes him ill. but he has gotten himself where he is. >> what do you make of what we saw in georgia overall? the district attorney they are saying that she wants to have a march trial date? she's actually asking for march 4th as a trial date. whether or not that actually happens remains to be seen, but does that seem realistic just given the makeup of this case, how complexities? and the fact that there are 19 codefendants here? >> i think what's gonna slow down the georgia case is others will file the kind of motion that mark meadows has filed to remove the case to federal court. while the state proceedings will continue, will bog things down a little bit -- and i don't really believe from my top with lawyers who have really study this body of law

about removal that they are going to remove the case to federal court. and if they do, it's still the same georgia prosecutors. and the calendar could even be even claver at the federal level. i don't know. it's just eight different jury pool. broader, wider. so, that's what's likely to slow it down, kaitlan, the removal proceedings. >> so you don't think they'll likely be able to get it removed from a state proceeding -- as mark meadows is doing -- but also we are told by sources that trump is also likely to do that. you don't think that's likely? >> i don't. it's hard to envision this as official behavior of any of the people when you read that indictment, when you read what is being included. mark meadows was not just setting up meetings, he was not arranging telephone calls. that's done by secretaries, staffers, white house operators.

he's in the thick of this, and motion.indictment brings his so i don't think they're going to prevail. many of them don't even have federal standing to remove. those who are the fake electors, for example. and it's just limited to those who were in federal office when these events happened. >> yeah, and to bring this full circle, rudy giuliani is also saying, he is going to -- make that argument, though. he obviously did not work for the federal government. we'll see what the courts decide. john dean, thank you for your insight tonight. >> not a chance. thank you, kaitlan. >> so, as we noted, even rudy giuliani's attorney is saying that he is, essentially, broke, and that donald trump is not going to be helping, any more, we are told by sources. that stands in stark contrast to the millions that giuliani once made working for trump. actually 9.5 million dollars in 2017.

$5 million in 2018, according to disclosures that were made during his divorce. the connection between giuliani's reputation and the fate of trump are so intertwined -- i mean, everyone remembers when giuliani stood in front of the soon to be mob on january 6th and said this. >> if we are wrong, we will be made fools of. but if we are right, a lot of them will go to jail. so, let's have trial by combat. i am willing to stake my reputation. the president is willing to stake his reputation on the fact that we are going to find criminality there. >> if you are surprised tonight to hear about the struggles that giuliani is having financially, you probably shouldn't be. the money problems make sense when you just take a step back and see how much legal trouble the new york mayor, former

mayor of new york, is facing. in 2. 7 billion dollar defamation suit by smartmatic. rudy giuliani also owes a grant for punishment for not turning older over records in a separate defamation suit, in which he's already and acknowledged making false statements about election workers. that's before you get to the 10 million dollar sexual assault and harassment case, and which his former assistant has tate and texts. and now the fulton charges of the fulton county district attorney brought against trump, giuliani, and 17 others. all of this is coming as giuliani is facing disbarment proceedings here in new york and washington. that means right now he cannot make money from practicing law. giuliani has formally embraced his role as the base of trump's election lie, something the trump himself personally ordered. he spent months speaking at increasingly bizarre press conferences and his reputation today is not as it once was.

he is now the guy who stood outside the four seasons landscaping pushing lies like this one. >> after all, joe frazier is still voting here. kind of hard since he died five years ago. joe continues to vote. >> before that happened -- before we were at four seasons total landscaping in philadelphia -- he was the mayor that america watched walked through the cloud of dust on 9/11, who graced the cover of time magazine as a, quote, tower of strength. use once the most popular politician in the country and at the time the leading candidate for the republican nomination. his incredible climb started with the same type of law that he is now charged under in the state of georgia. this is a man who, according to the new york times in 1989, quote, long asserted that he invented the use of the racketeer influenced and corrupt organizations act now known as rico, to pursue the mafia commission. he was so associated with the law that when cnn did a story

in 1988, giuliani was the face of a wave of rico prosecutions. >> the racketeer influenced and corrupt organizations act, called rico for short, passed by congress in 1970, prosecutors love it. >> the activities of organized crime, the drug dealing, the extortion, the labor racketeering, the murders, the executions, they've also been around for a long time the and the government up until now has been virtually ineffective in dealing with it. >> the leggy legacy he still clinging to even now. >> i am the same rudy giuliani who went after the mafia. i haven't changed one bit. >> few people know exactly how much rudy giuliani has indeed changed, more than my next guest, andrew kirtzman. he has literally written a book -- two of them, actually -- on the former mayor. we are going to talk about what he thinks happened to rudy giuliani giuliani right after this.

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this is a very different giuliani than when you first started covering him, when he was living how he was doing. >> your. giuliani used to buy his suits off the rack at golf men's, i think, for $400 a piece. people around him would comment about how money was so not important him, that was all about power to him. what changed was 9/11. he became one of the most beloved people on the planet. a poll said that he was more popular than the pope at one point, and he opened up a consulting company -- giuliani partners -- that made 100 million dollars in five years. it became stratospheric lee wealthy. he bought six houses, 11 country club memberships. i interviewed -- >> 11? >> 11. judith giuliani, his ex-wife, spoke to me at length in my book and there's a quote in the book that was quite amazing and harrowing, which was that we were spending $250,000 a on a month on sheer fun.

he was living a very, very lavish lifestyle. he spent it recklessly, divorced judith giuliani, gave a lot away and now the legal bills, he's just drowning in legal bills. and the fact that donald trump won't bail him out is just absolutely tragic. >> frigid $40,000 -- we are told that giuliani has seven figures in legal fees that he's is facing. >> i mean, he is being sued for defamation, he's under criminal indictment, criminal investigation in d. c.. there are civil suits against him. ruby freeman this, the woman, the election worker in atlanta is suing him. he is representing himself in some cases because he's burning through his money. >> you've covered him for 30 years. does this surprise you? >> nothing surprises me when it comes to rudy giuliani. the reason i've been covering him for 30 years is that he is

such a complex, over the top, larger than life figure. he is an opera fan and his life is an opera. he almost escapes death on 9/11. he busted the mob, ran for president, had this extraordinary flame out in 2008. he goes to ukraine, leads to one presidential impeachment, tries to upend democracy under trump, leads to a second impeachment. there is no story like rudy giuliani. his is one of, i guess, the most extraordinary political rise and fall stories of our time. >> what happened to him? when people ask -- that is the question of rudy giuliani feels like, when -- the white house, when he was having a press comforts when his hair dye was running down his hair. he's at four seasons total landscaping. that is the question, what happened to rudy giuliani? >> i think in a word it was desperation. i think his rise to power was

so extraordinary -- like, hero prosecutor, hero mayor. and presidential candidate who was leading in the polls for a full year in 2008 in the republican primary. he lasts just eight weeks in the republican primary. he drops out in total humiliation with just one delegate, falls from grace, loses his 9/11 halo, and suddenly he is out in the wilderness, and who comes to his rescue but donald trump? he literally houses him in mar-a-lago soon after the election, he had fallen into hey depression, he was drinking. giuliani had kind of hit rock bottom. and we dial trump who is kind of his ticket back to power in 2016. it was donald trump who needed rudy giuliani when he was running for president in 2016, trump didn't have any political friends. he needed giuliani and giuliani needed trump, because nobody

was calling giuliani for his endorsement except for trump. >> do you think that's why giuliani was so willing to do what trump -- i mean, he went to ukraine and looked into all that. trump was telling people in ukraine -- ukrainian officials -- talk to rudy giuliani, instead of the attorney general. like, you work with the justice department. trump put him put him in charge of going in pushing's election lies. rudy giuliani did all of that and then some. >> giuliani, after all of trump's election lawyers, campaign lawyers, united states attorney general had told trump that he had lost the election, there was only one man telling him he had one, and that was rudy giuliani. and that, of course, predictably, he put rudy giuliani in charge of the election situation with when trying to turn around the race. giuliani was there with trump when they turned off the lights at the white house. the last man standing telling standing telling him that he

had still won. the trump the fact that trump is not telling paying his legal bills -- it's remarkable. >> but it's not really surprising. that is trump's m. o.. michael cohen and people like -- they say this is kind of what he does. what about the fact that giuliani is now facing -- i mean, he's not just in over his head in legal fees. he's facing criminal charges in georgia for the same law he used to use here to go after members of organized crime. >> the irony is extraordinary. rico is not just a legal statute for giuliani. rico is part of his story personalities, part of his story. giuliani tells the story over and over how back then when he was still number three in the justice department, he was overhearing the television with joe banano, who had inexplicably written an autobiography, who talked about the commission like the godfather scene where all the mobsters sat around and kind of made their big decisions. and according to giuliani, he

had this light bulb moment, where he said, i can use rico and charge them all at once. and that's what he did, and he was successful. and it made him world famous, and an american hero. but for the atlanta grand jury now to indict him on rico charges, it's kind of like a stab of a knife in the heart of the giuliani story. you must be devastated by it. >> andrew kirtzman, your book -- you have enough material for more books, i would say. the rise and fall -- from the rise in tragic fall, i should say, of america's mayor rudy giuliani. thank you. >> thank you. >> if you want to know about more about the rudy giuliani story, given, of course, there is so much there, there saturday night a8:00, saturday, cnn original series what happened to americas's mayor. ask the man considered a hero in the aftermath of 9/11 became the architect of donald trump's election conspiracies. also coming up next for us

tonight, the fulton county district attorney fani willis has now proposed a date for donald trump. how his court calendar is lining up with the political one and the complications there. also, new reporting on trump's current thinking about whether or not he is going to show up for that first debate one week from tonight. a limited time flavor drop. new crispy dragon shrimp. one of seven endless choices for just $20. right now, only at red lobster. welcome to fun dining. hi, i'm todd. i'm a veteran of 23 years. i served three overseas tours. i love to give back to the community. i offer what i can when i can. i started noticing my memory was slipping. i saw a prevagen commercial and i did some research on it.

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>> fulton county district attorney fani willis asking a judge to set a trial date for march 4th, 2024, adding to trump's dizzying calendar of overlap in coues and the campaign trail, after trump is facing a civil trial here in new york and october. he could stand trial and

spial counsel jack smith's election conspiracy case in the defamation suit, all in the midst of the iowa caucuses. funny willis's case in georg could start one day before super tuesday if it goes -- as she is asking -- that is when voters in more than a dozen states are also going to go to the polls. georgia voters, eight days later, are going to be casting their primary votes. and this does not even factor in the classified documents case and when that could happen. trump, and his 18 codefendants in georgia tonight, have nine more days to voluntarily surrender, which, we are told, is what happened at the fulton county jail in atlanta. so far, we are told that no one has turned themselves in and, instead, trump's attorneys are right now in talks about the details of what that surrender will look like and when it could happen. to discuss more tonight with two political veterans -- than jones, a former obama administration official, and kristin soltis anderson, a republican strategist and pollster -- we have all the legal questions but there is also the political aspect. -- there's polling out saying he's

still enjoying strong support from republicans, no surprise there. more of them want him to run that they did even in april. but when it comes tohe general, -- percent of republicans say they would support trump in november 2024, but only 53% of americans say they definitely would not back him. the republicans say that? are they looking at these numbers? >> republicans are looking at joe biden saying, there is no way america is going to vote for that guy. we can put up down trump, and he's a fighter, and he will win. that is why a lot of these attempted electability argument that you have seen folks like ron desantis suddenly making the primary say, well, i'm the winner, on the one who knows how to win, that unspoken contrast they are being down trump doesn't know how to win -- republican voters just don't really buy that. that doesn't mean that he is guaranteed to be the nominee and it certainly doesn't mean that, if he is the nominee, that he would be the next president, as many republicans really think. but i do think that this general election -- a lot of those polls show it -- not too far apart between trump and biden in a hypothetical

rematch. republicans do not think that he is the political person poison that, say, some independents think he. is >there are new numbers to back that up. the quinnipiac poll shows that the hypothetical match between biden and trump is a vtual tie. what does the white house say when they see those numbers? especially when they see all the indictments and charges and problems? >> i think they probably -- the sound you hear is them banging their heads against the wall. because the economic numbers are starting to look a lot better. you are a year out from the i.r.a. being passed -- the inflation reduction act -- being passed. that looks like it is going really well. jobs are being created. they end up getting zero attention because their main candidate who is being updated all the time. and folks seem to like it. [laughter] -- like, this is not. by the way, the people in the republican party who apparently like all the -- stuff they would not hire someone who had 91 felony charges against him. they wouldn't give that person a job interview. and yet they're willing to put someone like that in the white house. it is bizarre. >> it is also completely sucking up all the oxygen's --

>> all -- >> -- maybe every single last bit of. it ron desantis is in iowa today where he has basically been station for the past several weeks. he was asked about these many indictments. he says he thinks the republican party needs to move on. >> if we are fighting about what happened in 2020 or january 6th 2021, if that is what the election ends up about, joe biden is going to be hanging out in his basement in delaware again, not to care in the world, and republicans are going to lose. >> trump is holding a news conference on monday to finally prove his fraud claims. this is not going away. it is still something that trump is making an unavoidable topic. >> no. and that color that you just showed at the start of the segment really confirm that not only that is not going away. this is going to be that thing dominating the headlines in the heat of republican primary season. and even if -- i am skeptical that these charges actually make any republicans really more likely

to vote for him. but it is certainly solidifies those around him. it makes him feel like they need to take defensive action, stand by their guy, and keep supporting him, almost as a way to kind of just stick to the other side. as long as that is an area around the primaries, it will make it very hard for many of these other contenders, who the polls show republicans really like. ron desantis -- they like tim scott. they like vivek ramaswamy. they like all these folks. -- donald trump still owing the conversation. >> mike pence is having to say today, trump -- georgia was not stolen. brian kemp, the republican governor of georgia, also had to say that recently. i don't even know what you are going to say about this. but marjorie taylor greene was asked about this. and she basically had these -- she was asked about that and whether or not, because of that, when she was happy with brian kemp for saying that, if she would challenge him if he ran for senate. th isomething that he is rumored to do. that is not the point of her que. but she said, i haven't made up my mind whether i will do that or not. i have a lot of things tk about. am i going to be part of president trump's cabinet if he wins?

is it going to be possible that i will be vp? >> look, first of all, who is marjorie taylor greene? who are you talking about? she has never passed a bill. she has never chaired a committee. she has never done, literally, anything at all except to be an obnoxious controversial east. but she might be the vp. in this -- upside down bizarre world, her word matches up against a successful governor? and the former vice president -- and that is the world that we are in. donald trump made that world we are, if you just are obnoxious enough and crazy enough and have enough lunatic tweets, you can dominate the conversation. he is doing. she is doing. it it is not good for america. >> what were those senate confirmation hearings even look? like >> [laughter] -- >> if she is nominated to a cabinet post? >> it would just be a circus inside of a zoo on fire. [laughter] -- >> i circus in side of his you on fire. >> that would be -- >> all right, van jones,

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>> president biden announcing today that he and the first lady will visit maui on monday after republicans including

former president trump criticize his response to the tragedy so far. i should know he's also declared an emergency declaration for their. he's also spoken to multiple officials. but on monday the bidens are going to be able to see firsthand the devastation from the deadly wildfires that have claimed at least 110 lives, according to the latest counts. tonight, officials are warning, that number is going to rise, they believe, as search and rescue teams are continuing to comb through the aftermath. that is wreckage that the hawaii governor josh green described to me as reminiscent of 9/11. it's that difficult to be going through this, not only finding people, but also identifying those that they do find. so far, about a third of the burn area has been searched, as this painstaking process of identifying victims continues. officials have even had to ask relatives to provide dna samples. joining me now, again tonight jeff hickman the director of public affairs for hawaii's department of defense. jeff, it's good to see you again, thank you for coming back on. can you describe, we spoke the other day, what is the search

operation like on the ground right now, as it stands tonight? >> the search efforts have increased multiple times over. it went from 20 search canines to 40. coming from 15 different states. that just shows you the aloha and the effort that our nation is taking in getting maui exactly what they need. right now, the search, you said one third of the area is searched. the death toll will go up, more bodies will be found. and we'll start to bring closure to those who need it and identify those missing. there is assistance centers helping those who are missing. there's the civilian list going around. and dna being collected to help make the match, and help people find those who were missing it. >> the last time you and i talked, you estimate about 1000 people were missing. where does that number stand tonight? >> that hasn't changed. they are still estimating many,

many more people to be found. with the teams increasing in size, both from the national guard, fema and local first responders, firefighters now are able to leave the fires. there is still some fires burning in hotspots, now they can assist the others in the area that's affected. that's great. with that effort, they're gonna start going into buildings. when they do that, the numbers will go up a lot. i was able to talk to search and rescue team members from the hawaii national guard and. the first thing is they do, they walk through the area. the first thing they do is, they listen for anybody who might be making a noise. that's heart wrenching. but on that team is searchers and fatalities search and recovery personnel. when they do find a body, with compassion and care and time, they take that body and get it back to where it could be identified. it is taking a long time for

the search, to discover and recover the remains. so, we ask for patience during this time. >> you mentioned when the search team goes in, they're listening for sounds. are they hearing anything? >> no. sadly, they're not. that's part of the process. it's the steps they take. there is hope. but that's one of the steps they do. then they go back with a fine toothed comb, go over the area multiple times. it's sad, but they are getting better at their job. the motivation is families. this is a community based organization, these are guardsmen who are from the area. this is their community. they're used to cleaning up debris, maybe protecting people from going -- down certain roads during lava or floods. this is brand new. >> you mentioned those that are there, this is not what their normal jobs are. but what kind of other experts

i've been brought in? because the governor last night was comparing this to the aftermath of a war zone. he said it looked like ground zero after 9/11. obviously, different situations. but he was saying that is the kind of expertise that there needing people to come in and help identify people. >> yeah, they're bringing in completes teams. fema is over 400 personnel on the ground. assisting not just people of maui, assisting in the process of identifying, bringing in experts from around the world. to the little island of maui. with their expertise, it is actually helping the process. on top of that, you have grief counselors, you have chaplain chaplains, community outreach, you still have people who may be on the mainland, around the world. or somewhere other than maui, and they are the ones missing people, and it's really hard to connect to those personnel to the ones on maui. it's not just maui people missing maui people. there might be some

international people who are missing family and friends. and they are finding challenges as well. so, it's a very well-rounded situation. we're trying to help maui get a handle on that. >> jeff hickman, we are thinking of you, and everyone that you're working with and all the search teams. thank you for joining us tonight. >> mahalo. kaitlan. >> of course, we will continue to monitor updates there. three branches of the military do not have confirmed leadership tonight, because of tommy tuberville's hold on military promotions. the chairman of the senate armed services committee is here and he will join me join me next, and how he believes it is impacting military readiness. my dad started trek in a red barn in waterloo, wisconsin. and now it spans the globe. you wanna take what was given to you and you wanna build it. and you wanna pass it along. if i can do that, i would have done well. that's why we're here...

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side effects may not appear for several weeks. ask about vraylar and learn how abbvie could help you save. >> senate majority leader chuck schumer calling out senator tommy tuberville in demanding the republican leaders intervene in his ongoing efforts to block top military nominations. the alabama republican is stalling the nominations, in protest of the pentagon's abortion policy. as of tonight, his hold has left three military services -- as you can see here -- without senate confirmed leaders for the first time ever in u.s. history. the army chief of staff, the marine corps commandant, and the chief of naval operations,

all filled on an acting basis. more than 300 military officer promotions are currently on hold in total. joining me now to discuss, democratic senator jack reed, who is the chairman of the senate armed services committee. and senator, thank you for being here. the pentagon says it is not changing its policy. tuberville told me he is not lifting his hold until they do. where does this leave the military tonight? >> it leaves the military in a very precarious position. we have key leaders that are not in place. very sensitive areas. i just returned from germany. there we have coordinating activities for the ukraine. and the nominee for deputy commander of that organization is not in place. the commander can't assume all of the responsibilities. it's an incredible job. we have the commander of the pacific fleet, who is not in place. we have the marine corps commander in japan. this is also an effect that

cascades downward. because it sends signals to very promising young officers, kernels colonels lieutenant colonels that they're just political pawns. -- for the families. >> he said earlier this week that the republican leadership, because of the effects that you just talked about on military readiness, also on the families, that republican leadership needs to tell tuberville in public what they're saying in private. what are they saying in private? >> well, i think in private, they recognize many of the detriment, and the need to move quickly. that's all very nice. they have to come up, very publicly, on the floor, and say, this is an issue about the readiness of the united states. and the professionalism of our military forces. we have to move and confirm

these officers. otherwise, it gets worse and worse and worse. both for the soldiers, airman sailors, marines, airmen, and guardians of, and their families and the family issue cannot be ignored. >> we've spoken with several of those families. we've spoken of several of those families, they talk about -- it affects whether or not they can move, whether military spouses can start new jobs. getting their kids in schools. we talked about that with tuberville directly. but the senate is on a five-week recess right now. senator schumer does set the schedule. and technically, some of these nominations could move individual. i understand what tuberville is doing is unprecedented, because usually, they're all done to gather. but couldn't democrats force a vote on some of these stalled nominees alone? >> well, if we had to vote on all these nominees, i would've asked the congressional research and others, they estimated it would take about 30 days if we were working seven days a week in 24 hours a

day, to get these nominations through. that means we can't do the supplemental appropriation for the ukraine, which is absolutely critical for the success of the ukrainians, and for our, and nato success. we couldn't debate a continuing resolution to keep the government open. and if we pick and choose one or two, what about the rest of those men and women? they'll be left behind. one of the things about being in the military, you don't leave people behind. we have to get this done, as we've always done. which is, unless there is an objection based on facts, to a nominee, these nominees will move forward. that's what we have to do. it's the republicans we're who are gonna have to stand up, on the floor of the senate, and say, this is wrong. we must go ahead and confirm these officers, their own satisfaction, their own reward for service. also, for the safety of the nation. >> what happens if they don't? >> well, i think they're

shirking their responsibilities, frankly. we have been on the floor constantly, asking to pursue these nominations. to talk about these nominations. you know, you get some indications, i think senator mcconnell said initially, oh, he doesn't support this. that's a lot different than going in and saying, we're gonna get this done. i think if they did that, that would send a signal that there are other ways to protest his objection to d. o. d. policy. they're more appropriate than this. this is just seriously harming our national security. we have to stand together, both as republicans and democrats, more importantly, as americans, who value and respect the service of our men and women in uniform. frankly, the irony is, some of

these people will be the first in line with the american flag pins on, telling how much they enjoy and support the military. now, it's time to stand up and support the military. >> senator jack reed, thank you for time tonight. >> thank you very much. >> object, former aide to the indicted new york congressman, george santos. now has an indictment that matches his bosses. that starts working in 30 minutes, while other allergy sprays take hours. with astepro's unbeatably fast allergy relief you can astepro and go! you founded your kayak company because you love the ocean- not spreadsheets. you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. indeed instant match instantly delivers quality candidates matching your job description. visit indeed.com/hire my cpa told me i wouldn't qualify for the erc tax refund, so i called innovation refunds. their team of independent tax attorneys will work with your cpa to determine if

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